2010/12/13

The Eighth Wonder Of The World

How to have a threesome ... without booze.
Sweeter than candy ...

PZN:
This is my first 100% sober experience with 2 women. It really is something else when everyone’s sober. As far as I'm concerned, if you're drunk, it doesn't even count anymore. You need to know how to do this without needing liquid courage or giving the girls an excuse. You need more game, but it’s way more satisfying. Everyone’s totally aware of what’s happening. As a man, you need to lead every step of the way. Of course, the girls have to be open to this, and ideally “help” you rather than cockblock you.

I always say, in a two-person interaction, you can control 50% of the dynamics. In a three-way interaction, you can only control 33%. In other words, anyone who thinks the guy does all the work is just lying to themselves. I won’t pretend as though the women didn’t help and want this as much as I did just to get some ego validation from guys in the community. In a way, the guy’s job is to allow this to happen. It’s to not fuck it up. It’s also to screen the right women who are bisexual or bicurious.

By the way, I’ve never seen any threesome material in the community. I asked many guys to hook me up with stuff, but no one actually did. So I used what I knew and what my instinct told me. I stopped relying on controlling everything and necessarily making it happen. I told myself, it may happen, it may not, accept the imperfection of things. If nothing else, simply have a good time with 2 beautiful women. Don’t make the threesome the goal.

One more thing, I’m a guy who talks a lot. You might notice this in the post. I don’t shut up. I guess it’s because I want to make sure I cover all bases and prepare for all possible contingencies. But truthfully, interactions are never like that. You can never be 100% responsible, because you don’t control other human beings. The most you can do is influence them.

That being said, let’s move on to how this whole thing went down.

There’s a girl I picked up at the gym a few months ago (call her Julia). We’re sort of dating now. She’s 18. She’s got a great personality and is very mature. Aside from the fact that she’s really hot and really good in bed, I screened her early on to see whether or not she’s bisexual, or at least bi-curious. In other words, I asked questions after sex like, “Have you ever had an experience with another woman ?” or, “How many times have you kissed another girl ?”

I also told her my philosophy about this stuff when she asked about me trying to have a threesome. I said, “Too many people in society think a threesome is something a guy dreams of or something two girls give a guy. I don’t see it that way. If I decide to share that with you, I want it to be a gift I give you and a gift you give me. It’s something three people share together because they want the pleasure to be more intense.”

I made rules clear, like “This is the kind of intimate event that happens between three people, and stays between them. For example, if you’re my girl, and we share this with one of your girls who’s comfortable with it, we will make sure everyone has the time of their life. But it will stay 100% between us, because society is judgmental and I don’t want anyone feeling guilty or bad for sharing something so beautiful and uniquely intimate together.”

Just for the record, I don’t really date women that aren’t bi-curious. I’m a professional, and I have a list of criteria I need in a woman. This makes things clear from the get-go, and I become the selector, not the selectee. Amongst those criteria are the following: bi-sexual, very attractive, intelligent, feminine and submissive, extremely clean, adventurous, loves to cook, etc. Basically, if a woman doesn’t have these things, she realizes she doesn’t have what it takes to be with someone like me.

The other week, Julia asked me if I see us ever being in a couple. I responded vaguely with, “You know, you seem to really have the qualities I look for in a girlfriend, but it’s important for us to get to know each other better in order to make the best possible decision, because a relationship is something very important and serious to me. For example, I’m slowly getting to know you. I’m realizing you’re mature. You seem open-minded about your sexuality when it comes to other women, you seem very respectful of me and my goals, you cook really well (she invited me over for a great candlelight dinner one night) etc.”

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Basically, it’s a way to tell her that if she doesn’t have those qualities you look for, you’re not really interested in getting serious because you can get better elsewhere. The thing is, I really like her too, and in a way, I sometimes wonder if she’d really be down to be in a serious relationship, or if she just said that. But then again, we pretty much act like a couple in public. Who knows ? You can never control another person. I guess you need to know what you yourself want, and not expect from the other person more than they’re willing to give.

Fast forward to last week. We were training together at the gym and I kept teasing her, grabbing her ass or her pussy while she was exercising. She kept getting pissed off, but excited. At some point when I got close, she initiated the conversation. And this is why I say a girl needs to be down herself. She’s like, “Hey, you know, I was talking to one of my girlfriends this week about what we talked about.”

I’m like, “Sure. And ?”

She’s like, “Well, she’s really interested to try something like that, but she’s not sure if our friendship (Julia and her friend) would stay the same.”

I responded with, “I want you guys to be super comfortable about this. It’s my number one rule. I know that if you truly respect each other, even if we all shared some intimate moments, you would still respect each other if your friendship is real.”

She says, “It is real.”

So I said, “Well what kind of girl is she, what’s she look like ?”

She answers, “She’s really hot. She’s Latina.”

In my head, I’m thinking nice. Then I said, “You know what, don’t pressure her. I know both of us know we could make this something really enjoyable for everyone, but why don’t we all just hang out and not do anything. Let’s just see how the energy is between all three of us.”

She goes, “That’s a good idea.”

So I told her, “One more thing. I want you to tell me if there’s something you wouldn’t feel comfortable with me doing to your friend, like kissing her, or holding her.”

She says, “No, she’s my best friend, with her, you can do anything”

I said, “Ok, you trust her ?”

She’s like, “Yeah.”

(For the record, the whole “let’s hang out without expectations” thing was an idea given to me by Frank B. Kermit. This guy is probably one of the only guys I know who’s able to teach game in a way that will truly change you as a whole. He will turn game into something you are, not something you do).

Anyway, last night I sent her a text asking her if she’d like to grab a cup of something warm because it’s so rainy outside. She texted back with, “I’d have loved to, but I’m with my friend and we’re working on a school project. We’re going to the gym after. Do you want to meet her ?”

I text back with, “Well, I already hit the gym today, but you guys can drop by after for a shisha if you’d like.” This was at 6 pm. She texts back 10 minutes later with, “Is it ok if we come by at 7:30 pm. ?” I said “Sure.”

I was fucking nervous because I didn’t know what to do or what not to do. I simply told myself, “PZN, deep inside you already know what you have to do. You can’t control everything that happens, just try and have a good time, and realize that you want it to happen. It might, or might not.”

I got a call from her at 7:10 and they were downstairs. They came up and I said, “You guys are early !”

Julia’s like, “I’m sorry!”

I’m like, “Why don’t you go out and wait in the rain for 20 minutes and ring the doorbell again ?”

This makes both of them laugh and I ask them to come in. She introduces her friend to me. Hot Latina. Petite with a really nice face and perky little ass. I take their coats and tell them to come in and make themselves comfortable. I talk to both of them a little bit. I give Julia a kiss on the lips and the other one a kiss on her cheek. I tell her, “Sorry, no kisses on the lips for you !”

They both laugh. The vibe is good. We talk a bit more and I ask if they’re down for shisha. They’re like “Sure !” I ask them to follow me because I need their help. I get them both really involved and make sure none of them feel left out. Whenever I kiss or kinoLook up this term Julia, I make sure I lightly kinoLook up this term the other one too. For example, if Julia said something funny, I would tell her she’s hilarious and kiss her on the cheek. Then, 2 minutes later, when HBLatina talked, I would hug against her and say stuff like, “Omg, you’re almost as crazy as your friend here !” I obviously had to make HBLatina feel more and more comfortable because she was the one I hadn’t slept with yet.

So I did a variety light-kino escalation things. When I needed to get a shisha I asked them, “Ok, who is lighter between the two of you ?” I look at them and say “HBLatina, you look lighter, come here.” They’re both like, “Omg, you’re so mean !” I’m like, “You girls are hilarious, I didn’t say Julia’s fat, I said you’re lighter. I mean isn’t someone necessarily lighter lol?”

I lift her up and ask her to grab my shisha from the top of the fridge. This was an example of great natural playful kinoLook up this term escalation. Then I compliment them and say, while preparing the shisha, “You guys look so damn cute together.” The Latina’s like, “Yeah, Julia’s my babygirl !” Julia’s like “No, HBLatina’s my babygirl !” I’m like, “You guys should be a couple !” They’re like, “Yeah, we’re lesbians.” I’m like, “Damn, we have something in common, I’m a lesbian too ! But don’t tell anyone.”

I keep the vibe playfully sexual like this. I tell Julia to stand up and I hug her and HBLatina looks at us. I’m like, “Aww, HBLatina, you can’t just sit there, come be part of the hug. It’s a triangle here. No one gets left out. Sharing is caring.” They laugh and we all hug. I give Julia a kiss on the cheek and give HBLatina a kiss on the cheek too. I break off the threeway hug and tell them to go smoke shisha. Then Julia’s like, “Hey PZN, you have to show her how good you are at Bachata.” The thing is, Julia’s really shy to dance Bachata with me because I’m really good. HBLatina taught Julia. So I’m like, “All right I’ll dance with her.” We go to the living room and I put on some bachata. I leave the room so that they can be together for a few minutes. I come back and notice they are dancing Bachata together. I start dancing with Julia and then tell her to go smoke the shisha until the smoke’s ready. I start dancing with HBLatina. She dances close. I know she’s into me.

Then Julia got up and I poked her titty just to tease her. And HBLatina’s like “Hahaha !”

Julia says, “Yeah, he’s crazy”

I’m like, “Yeah, you don’t know the half of it,” and I poke HBLatina’s tit too.

She says, “Omg, you can’t do that.” Julia goes and hugs her right away.

I’m tell her, “Sorry if you didn’t like it, you can poke me back on my tit if you want.” They laugh. I’m add, “But for real guys, I don’t get it. Why is it a big deal to touch a tit and not an arm ? It’s all human meat. Isn’t it ?”

They’re like “Yeah … but ...”

I’m like “Yeah but … let’s dance Bachata !”

I start dancing with the Latina again. The vibe is good. I ask Julia, “Can I dance close with her ?”

Julia’s like, “Yeah.”

I say, “Isn’t this funny, we don’t even ask her for her opinion, she’s like our object !”

Julia’s like, “Yeah, she’s our object.”

I ask, “But she’s an object we’re going to treat well and pleasure, right ?”

Julia says, “Yeah, of course.”

Meanwhile, the Latina says, “You guys can’t do this !”

I’m like, “So Julia, if I wanted to kiss her, and you said it was ok, I could kiss her ?”

Julia says, “Yeah, all you need is my permission.”

I tell her, “Good, I’ll ask after, I don’t want to kiss her yet !”

Then I invite Julia to come dance with us Big Mac style. I tell Julia that HBLatina is going to be the meat patty and we are the buns. We dance and I tell Julia to kiss HBLatina’s neck because I felt like she was turned on. As she begins kissing her neck. I notice her moaning a little bit, and I begin kissing her lips a little. She reciprocates. Such a dirty fucking kisser, bites and uses lotsa tongue. Women are such horny little creatures. We have no idea.

With one hand I undo Julia’s bra, and with the other, HBLatina’s. Their bras fall off and they’re like “OMG, you’re good ! What the fuck ? You did both at once ?” Then they pull back and they’re like, “Ok, we’re not going any further.”

I’m like, “I want you guys to be happy and comfortable. We can stop at any point. After all, this is only our first date.” They laugh. I tell HBLatina, “From now on, you might have a boyfriend (me) and a girlfriend (Julia) so we have to take things slowly !”

Also, just as a reminder, on many occasions, whenever I felt that one of them wasn’t comfortable, I would always reiterate with, “Look, let’s go slower if you guys aren’t comfortable. I want all 3 of us to have pleasure. Not only one person. Not 2. All 3 of us. This is the triangle of love !” Honestly, with this mindset, it’s so much more beautiful than boozing bitches up and hoping for something to happen. Turn it into a game.

At some point I even suggested a threeway kiss and threeway smoke-sharing. The whole thing turned into an intense threeway make out session, and I stopped the whole thing with, “God, it’s so weird to kiss 2 people at the same time, it’s as though I’m kissing an alien or some shit. Both sides of your lips being kissed at once is such a different sensation !” We were laughing and having a good time. It’s all just a fun game.

Julia said she was on her period and they kept saying, “This wasn’t planned.” I’m like, “I know. It just happened that we all felt comfortable together. I rarely get along with my girls’ friends because usually they’re too different. But you, HBLatina, you’re as sweet and as pretty and apparently as crazy as Julia.” They’re like, “Yeah, we’re both crazy.”

At this point, I knew direct sexual escalation wouldn’t work. So I told Julia to get close to me and said, “Listen, there’s no rush for anything, I know you know that. Let’s just give your friend a little massage.” She’s like, “Sure.” We throw HBLatina on the bed and begin caressing her, touching her, gently massaging her. I tell Julia, “Why don’t you gently kiss her ?” As Julia begins to kiss her, I begin kissing her, too. Julia’s kissing her lips, I start kissing her neck. HBLatina’s really getting turned on.

I take Julia’s hand and lead it to HBLatina’s pussy, from above the panties. We both begin rubbing her pussy and kissing her. I can only imagine how much pleasure she was having. Eventually, Julia ends up on top of me rubbing up against me (with her panties on, of course). They eventually change positions and I ask Julia to put me in her mouth. She does. Then I begin fucking the other one. Before this happened, HBLatina looked at me and said “You’re a pretty lucky guy you know that ?”

I say, “What makes you think you guys aren’t lucky girls ?” HBLatina tells me, “You know this is every guy’s dream ?”

I answer, “Do you really think every guy would take the time to make you feel comfortable so that you feel as much pleasure as he does ?”

They’re like “No, you’re right.”

Test passed.

After that, I tell them we’re going to play a game. I will close my eyes and try to guess who’s kissing me and licking me down there. We begin playing the game and they’re really into it. I cheat, because frankly they both give amazing head. The only difference is Julia spits on it once in awhile because she knows I love it when she’s dirty. Eventually, I stand up and they both start having fun with it. Women are crazy. Seriously. I tell them to start kissing. It was exactly like in a porn movie. They make out, one sucks your dick, the other your balls. It’s a pretty insane feeling. It’s worth all the hard-work I put in these past 3-4 years. HBLatina didn’t want to swallow, so the pleasure was all Julia’s lol.

Anyway, after I got all my pleasure, I thought to myself “These girls are fucking amazing, the last thing I need is buyer’s remorse.” So I wait until all the heat cools down. As they’re getting ready to leave, because it was getting late, I ask Julia, “Do you think your friend is comfortable with all this, it being her first time and all ?” Julia didn’t seem too sure. So I take them both to my bed, lay down with each of them by my side and explain everything again.

“Guys, I understand this wasn’t planned. And the last thing I expected was for this to happen as well. But I want both of you to feel comfortable about this and be assured that what happened here tonight is staying between the three of us. Society might say this is bad, but I think you guys are great, open-minded girls. HBLatina, I’m glad you’re as sweet and as beautiful as your friend Julia. I want both of you to know that I really respect you, and what we shared tonight and hopefully will share again is just an expression of how comfortable we feel together. Even if for one moment, if one of you feels guilty about this, don’t. We’re actually mature enough to please ourselves rather than society. We shared this because we’re generous enough to give each other pleasure. No one can judge us for that.”

I then proceeded to tell HBLatina, “Next time, it’s going to be for Julia, we’re really going to bring her to heaven. Ok ?” HBLatina’s like, “Yeah ! She’s my babygirl.”

Anyway, I bring Julia home and then bring the other one home. I kiss both of them on the lips when I drop each of them off. It’s funny because they both kind of feel like girlfriends. The whole thing was very Vicky Cristina Barcelona style, if you know what I’m saying.

My only worries and concerns are to make it clear to Julia that she’s my girl and the other one is just her best friend that I will treat with respect. I don’t want to cause jealousy between them or ruin their friendship. In public, Julia is my girl and the other is just our friend. In private, they’re both my girls but Julia’s my primary and I have to explain this to both so that they understand this early on. Unless, of course, Julia wants something else.

Anyway, they just texted me and want to hang out again tonight. I guess I'll just hang out but do nothing sexual. I guess Julia's still on her period. Better to wait and make them comfortable. The sex will be so much better next time.

I hope this was detailed enough for those of you who want to share something like this. I promise all of you, if you do it right, it’s like the eighth wonder of the world.

But anyway, I’m open to thoughts or suggestions on how to frame things from here on in ?

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3 comments

tekniko's picture
Mon, 12/13/2010 - 14:35

Skeptical

I have read a bunch of this guy's reports, and while each one by itself reads like solid game, all together they sort of sink below the credibility line to me.

It isn't the number of women he claims to get. I know for a fact that there are guys who crush ass and pull numbers like what he describes.

What I find hard to believe is the frame he uses. Every single of one these girls gets the "let's celebrate our beautiful friendship by making love to each other" routine, often when he has only known the girl a few days. What happens to all these "friendships?"

Guys who claim ludicrous amounts of MLTRLook up this termS and FBLook up this termS usually get exposed just based on logistics. There's only so much time in a day to sleep, work, and take care of basic tasks over and above time you spend with chicks. Obviously you could get a chick into bed with that frame but then she's expecting a real friendship and a deep emotional connection with you (even if it isn't a "relationship") and he does this with literally every woman he writes about.

IMO he either exaggerates his success or (equally likely) he makes this "beautiful friendship" frame sound better than it really is and ends up pissing off a lot of girls.

PZN's picture
Tue, 12/14/2010 - 23:28

RE: "Skeptical"

Hey tekniko,

This is my first response on Cliff's List as Cliff's been asking me to join the website.

Your comment seems pretty negative. The purpose of my posts is simply to let people know what works for me. If you have limiting beliefs towards the way I operate, I understand.

I agree that it is very difficult to read a post and assess whether the person actually has game. I always ask myself the same thing when reading posts. It's natural.

Don't forget also that you only read about my successes. Cliff doesn't post my 150 failed approached or 50 failed attempts at threesomes. If you really want something, you will always get it. Don't forget that.

I'll respond to your remarks:

1. "What happens to all these "friendships?" "

Generally, the way I frame things is that we are very good friends, but it is only so natural for us to share other elements we naturally feel comfortable sharing: e.g. hanging out together, dancing together, travelling together, sleeping together, etc. I make sex look like such a normal element of the friendship that eventually it no longer seems like a big deal. I usually let women know that sharing intimacy together is just one of the many ways two people bond closer and feel more connected. I let them know that by knowing each other on an intimate level, we can bond closer each day and eventually, if we both feel ready, get more serious together. This is usually how an eventual friendship (with benefits) turns into a relationship, if the girl's earned it. I never lie about anything because most women out there really crave this no-strings-attached friendship. It's guilt-free sex everyone can enjoy. Therefore, in response to your comment about getting exposed, the way you make it sound is as though I'm hiding something, when you say "usually get exposed based on logistics". I don't hide anything. I don't rub in their faces that I'm seeing other women but if they ask, I don't lie. In fact I introduce these girls to one another sometimes, as my friends. If they ask whether I slept with the other, I simply respond "What kind of question is that?".

2. "There's only so much time in a day to sleep, work, and take care of basic tasks over and above time you spend with chicks"

You're right about this. We all do have limited time. But I generally leave myself time for 1-2 dates a week and 1-2 days to chill with my buddies. If you truly think about it, having 6-7 women on rotation who see you as a friend with no strings attached really doesn't eat up any time in your schedule. Making 5 minute calls to women every few nights is also not time consuming. One week you see Girl A and B, the next week, you see Girl C and D. The girls don't expect anything more than what you've promised. This is what you need to understand and perhaps implement in your game.

3. "IMO he either exaggerates his success or (equally likely) he makes this "beautiful friendship" frame sound better than it really is and ends up pissing off a lot of girls."

You are absolutely entitled to believing that I exaggerate my success. Like I said, I always have my doubts myself when reading posts. I guess the only person who knows how satisfying the threesome was is myself. Everyone else can have their doubts. My goal is not to prove anything to anyone but rather, offer objective advice others may use in their game. You seem like a kind of person with many limiting beliefs who makes assumptions (e.g. saying I "end up pissing a lot of girls off"). In my opinion, this is not a constructive or useful attitude to have.

I hope however, that the comments I offered will be beneficial in improving your game!

Best,

PZN

tekniko's picture
Thu, 12/16/2010 - 15:52

Hey PZN,I didn't mean to

Hey PZN,

I didn't mean to sound overly negative. Like I said, I wasn't so much questioning your game as your frame, wondering if there were drawbacks to this approach that you weren't indicating. Nor were my remarks targeted toward this post in particular.

You explain it much better here. I guess I'm just so used to reading about guys who claim 12 MLTRLook up this terms who all know about each other and love taking group showers that things like this setLook up this term of my inner skeptic.

I would be very interested to know, however, if you do experience any drawbacks to this approach? Do the girls get jealous? Do these friendships usually last a long time (and does the sex last as long as the friendship?) How many of these girls end up wanting a relationship with you, and how many stick around if it becomes obvious that you don't? Is this kind of lifestyle draining at all like MLTRLook up this terms can be? I'm not trying to grief you, I'm genuinely curious.