BUT DOES LOGIC mean anything to women who are in this state?...
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CLIFF'S LIST TECHNICALITIES:
Here is the list of the last 5 emails that were sent out:
1) She mentions the BF
, You ignore it.
2) Rather soft and using the teeth and ending with a suction like kiss
3) I said (without thinking) NO!
4) Like a wild and wooly semiautomatic truck bomb!
5) Nice girls will buy you the kind of burrito you like and bring it over, even when you didn’t ask for it.
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New Dating/Seduction Seminars & Workshop in Montreal by DOC!
Doc, who many of you know from his all too rare but outstanding posts on this list, on Mystery's Lounge, and the Montreal Lair, is bringing his seminars and speed dating events to Montreal. Previously they were mainly held in Toronto as part of the Learning Annex, Doc is now setting it up here and plans to hold events on a monthly basis.
The website is www.set nalife.com. The first seminars should be held shortly in Montreal. Registrations available on the website. The events are Dating Secrets for Women, a 3 Hour seminar (cost $50) and Dating Secrets for Guys; a Guide to The Art of Dating (also 3 hours and $50). There will also be a speed dating event in the evening for $50. You can contact Doc by email at seduction.school@sympatico.ca
Doc's next round of Seminars started last Sunday, June 6th in Montreal. Full-weekend Dating Makeover workshops will be offered about 2 weeks afterwards (including a half day with a personal stylist, video tape analysis of body language, and live practice sessions with dating coaches – beautiful women who will give the guys on the spot feedback on how they come across and what to improve). Other Montreal dates for June, July and August will be coming up soon. As well, there are some Toronto and New York dates for this summer that will soon be posted. If there is a group of 10 or more guys interested in a seminar (or 5 guys for a workshop, he would consider making a special trip to their city).
This is a great opportunity to learn from a real master.
While this edition of Cliff's List also contains some spectacular material, the special item I have been mentioning is STILL coming.
FREE VIDEO CLIP: Ross Jeffries has sent me a clip titled "Wake Up Nice Guy" which is available by email to anyone requesting it from me.
Dwacon (www.dwacon.com):
Prodigal Son Returns to the NLP/SS Fold...
I went on a self-imposed sabbatical from the world of NLP/SS/Sarging/etc. to rethink and re-evaluate things and transcend the booty-call mentality that seems very prevalent in the community and figure out how these skills would build a "conventional" relationship (whatever that is).
Granted, it is fun watching a woman get horny beyond comprehension and not knowing why she was feeling those things. It was awesome to be able to get a woman naked in seconds -- going from "no way I'm taking anything off" to getting stripped nekkid and absolutely loving it (more credit to my friends in the BSDM world than to the SS'ers for that trick). But it is one thing to get a woman to enter her "slut phase" and an entirely different thing to achieve some sort of quality relationship (whatever that happens to be).
Part of my analysis had to do with my attempt at understanding female psychology. It seemed incongruous that a woman would start out swearing on a stack of Bibles that she's a "good girl" and then watch that Jekyll & Hyde transformation into the wild slut who wants you in every hole. I had an experience where a petite HB8 spontaneously got off the sofa we were sitting on, laid down on the floor, and diddled herself. We were just on the sofa getting ready to watch TV and the next thing I know... HELLO! There wasn't any fun in that for me however. After she came, she turned about 20 shades of red and jetted out of there like her hair was on fire.
About two weeks later, I later saw her and her roommate walking down the street. Leslie looked at me as if I were Freddy Krueger and practically ran the other direction. Julie just gave me this look as if I had done some heinous thing. Well, maybe getting a woman excited via conversation is a heinous thing? But, I have always suspected it was more than that.
Prior to my discovering Ross Jeffries many many moons ago, I had an interesting dilemma where I only seemed capable of nailing married women. Trust me... that was the absolute LAST thing I wanted. Honestly, I only preferred single available girls. No desire to commit adultery. I only hung around the married ones because they have a tendency to offer advice and occasionally act the Yenta role. Invariably, for some reason I didn't understand, those married gals would get horny for me without any effort on my part while the single gals seemed to run for the hills.
From the camp counselor who tried to show me the world at the green age of 14 to the present day, it is mind-boggling how I find married women basically handing the panties over on a silver platter... and yet single girls legs clamp tighter than Fort Knox.
After my immersion in NLP/SS and the associated arts (cold reading, trance phrases, weasel words, patterns, thoughtballs, etc.) I managed to obtain a consistent 40-50% success rate (better with a group or wing, more spotty solo). But the best I could accomplish was getting the girls nekkid on my 600-count sheets, and then like Leslie they'd run off never to be seen again (except for the rare HB who would return for an encore).
Attempting to understand the convoluted female mentality (the book "Sexual Key" helped immensely there), it makes sense that American women are totally conflicted over their sexuality. One enlightening bit of expository came when I read the web blogs of the infamous Washingtonienne (the congressional intern whose diary of paid trysts with high-ranking politicos became public on washingtoniennearchive.blogspot.com/ -- making her the *next* Monica Lewinsky). One entry caught my eye.. of the six men she was banging, there was one she wanted to marry. The problem? I will quote her:
WASHINGTONIENNE BLOG QUOTE
> So I don't know if it's getting serious or what.
> We're seeing each other every day now. I like him
> very much and he likes me. But can it go anywhere,
> i.e. marriage? I don't know. He's Jewish, I'm not.
> And we have nasty sex like animals, not man and
> wife. But we work together, so there is an
> incentive to stay together and avoid an awkward
> breakup. And after a few months, people around
> the office will start "hearing wedding bells."
>
> I really just want to be a Jewish housewife with
> a big rock on my finger.
WASHINGTONIENNE BLOG QUOTE
The part I like is where she says "And we have nasty sex like animals, not man and wife." Is this an anomaly, or izzit a window on how women think...that anything more adventurous than 15 minutes of missionary under the covers once a week with the lights off falls under a different category...so if she meets some crazy guy in a peacock outfit talking trash and she blows him or lays him, she can't consider anything serious. Is that what the rest of you guys are finding?
Over the past several months, I've immersed myself in work and didn't get out much at all. When I did, I made a mental note not to slip into any patterns, weasel words or etc. No peacocking... zilch. I found something very interesting. I found that married gals were STILL consistently inviting me to lunch and then they would "innocently" launch into innuendo... "casual" mention of topics like vibrators and orgasms... and would initiate a lot of touching. It got embarrassing with one woman -- a co-worker -- she had her eyes on me in the workplace (absolutely verboten) and would go so far as to walk past me and nudge my crotch with her hips...she couldn't walk past me without some kino... playing footsies or resting a hand on my thigh. At the same time, all the single women would cry "sexual harassment" if I even looked in their general direction.
So I thought I would re-evaluate what was it that changed things for me when I was actively following the SS crowd and the one common denominator seemed to be either working with a group or with a wing. Basically, the benefit there was having someone to defuse cock-blocks and that "safety in numbers" thing where women feel more comfortable being approached by a set rather than a "crazed loner." Then again, there may be more to it than that...
I figured I would try doing something social for the first time in several months... so I went to a party at the Embassy of New Zealand. Unlike most events I've gone to in the past, there were more couples than singles. I approached the few single-girl-threesome-sets with the "no sarging... no sarging... no sarging" mantra playing in the back of my mind... and each time it was like the Freddy Krueger thing. I gave them an honest answer about my job (not the "I repair disposable cigarette lighters" line) and
they would get this incredulous look on their faces. Okay, enough of that.
Things were going nowhere, so I approached a set that had just entered and I just sarged the living hell out of this Ashley Judd lookalike. Don't know how long it took (the same song was still playing over on the dance floor so under 3 minutes) and she's got her arms around me and she's giggling like a schoolgirl and the corners of her mouth are running up towards her ears and she is full body pressed up against me. I'm thinking a f-close is guaranteed, but suddenly comes a stereo-CB... her two friends start poking her in the back to steal her attention and my buddy walks over and says, "You know, you're too old for that young girl. Shame on you." I figure I should slap him later...
The highlight of the evening was when a colleague arrived at the event with his wife (a petite-9) and single neighbor (blonde HB-9) with him. No surprise that the neighbor was COMPLETELY disinterested and non-communicative with me (looked at me as if I were the challenge on "Fear Factor") while his wife flirted and kino'ed me to the point where I figured I had better exit before this guy takes a swing at me (or worse, before he invites me to join him and his wife -- been there, done that... and nothing worse than having to jump into your clothes and run for your car because a swinger is jealous that you made his wife come faster and harder than he ever did).
The more I think about this... maybe I should just go back to the NLP/SS life. Rather than looking for the fertile valley into which I should plant my genetic code and raise little bald-headed progeny, perhaps I will just buy a silk robe and a pipe (tobacco, not crack) and go the Hugh Hefner route... nothing wrong with being 90-years-old with seven gorgeous blonde girlfriends, right?
Craiger (reposted from Mystery's Lounge with permission of the author):
How I use females as "Sexual Serial Killers"
A lot of guys make posts about using females as “pawns” or “pivots”. Early in my game I used both with great success, but I grew tired of juggling women or playing off different sets against each other…it just became the same routine night after night and BORING! I started to realize how much time, effort and money I was wasting playing the pawn and pivot game. For me it just wasn't worth the return.
I met a woman that is very bi-sexual, great body and personality, but most importantly, she is like me: A SEXUAL PREDATOR! One night, we were watching a movie about serial killers and after the movie was over she started to ask me about serial killers and how they operate (I was a Deputy Sheriff). I told her that a large percentage of serial killers operate in pairs and how one may feign injury or weakness in order to make the victim lower her guard thus rendering herself vulnerable to attack from the accomplice. Usually the victim never sees the attack coming and even if she does, it is too late. Serial killers will not initiate an attack unless there is a high probability of success and they PLAN and COORDINATE to INSURE that ALL ODDS ARE IN THEIR FAVOR! She was very intrigued by this topic, but we had “other” things to do….
Later in the evening, she told me that it was very difficult for her to go out on her own and find bi-sexual and lesbian girls, because of local taboos. That’s when I asked her if she would like to be a “serial killer”. Of course she was confused but then I told her that we could become “SEXUAL serial killers” together. She just smiled and said, “How”?
We run quite a few scams, but the one that has been the most successful runs like this:
1. She enters a bar before me, and SHE picks the target. If the target is sitting at the bar, for example, she will attempt to sit two chairs away from the mark and will place her coat or pocketbook on the chair in between her and the mark. This is to leave a place available for ME later in the evening.
2. She calls me on her mobile and gives me the location of the target and a target description detailed enough that there can be no mistaken identity.
3. I enter the bar alone and sit where the mark can clearly see that I am just another “AFC” by himself and that I am looking constantly in her general direction, but she CANNOT tell if I‘m looking at her. But understanding the vanity of most HB’s, she will MORE THAN LIKELY ASSUME that you are looking at her. I use this AGAINST the target later in the game.
4. After INTENTIONALLY drinking two drinks and INTENTIONALLY looking nervous as hell, I timidly walk over to the mark and say, “ Uh, excuse me. Like I'm not from around here and my language skills aren't that great. But, you see that girl over there, you know, the one next to you. I think she’s, like, so beautiful and I was wondering if you could help me learn something to say that’s, like, sweet and romantic to her. They ALWAYS teach me something corny to say like, “you’re the most beautiful girl in the world.” Or something mean like, “HI! I'm just a stupid American!” After practicing my new “line”, I approach my partner. The target is thinking, “Watch this chump CRASH and BURN!” She is totally shocked when……
5. My partner simply melts when I say something romantic or cracks up laughing when I say something stupid. No matter what I say, my partner responds in a POSITIVE way to ANYTHING I SAY and immediately hugs me and asks me to sit down. I sit with my back to the target and the target is thinking WTF? He DIDN'T crash and burn! Confusion sets in and the target becomes VULNERABLE!
6. My partner and I continue to bullshit with each other and enter into LIGHT kino. The target usually becomes jealous that I am getting all this attention from an HB. After all, she first thought that she was going to be able to shoot me down, but I wasn't interested in her, but in someone else. Then she expects me to get shot down by another female, but that HB responded in a POSITIVE manner! Now that HB is TOUCHING me! (Talk about social proof!)
7. I then turn towards the target, point to her and tell my partner, “That’s the one responsible!” (Drawing the target back into the set). My partner will then, physically get up and introduce herself to the target and then introduce me. At this point, I will buy a drink for both women and myself. This is one of the very rare times that I will do this, but I do it to make the target feel at ease and it makes it easier to EV.
8. My partner then begins to thank the mark for introducing her to one of the greatest guys she ever met, how she was always looking for a guy like me blah, blah, blah, he’s so wonderful…..and then tells the target, “Look, I'm going to take him to a more cozy place right now, but I was thinking that maybe sometime next week ALL THREE OF US could get together for drinks…why don't you give me your phone number?” (We’re batting 1000 on this so far guys!) They always give the number.
9. Very important part of the game follows: As we leave my partner kisses the target, not on the cheek, but partially on the lips and the cheek. It has to look like a slip BUT IT ISN'T! It is a test to gauge her propensity to bi-sexuality! If she doesn't recoil from the kiss, she is worth calling. I kiss her goodbye on the cheek and then hug her tightly making sure that our loins touch. If she doesn't recoil away, she is DEFINITELY going to get a call from us.
This type of game might not be for everyone, but it is field tested and proven to work. The most critical factor is choosing your partner carefully. You must work with great cohesion and be great actors, but this is a game that only gets smoother the more often you try it. Come on guys! Push the envelope and try something new!!!!!
The most important aspect of our game is that we set UP the target to be ALONE and thus ISOLATED with us at a later time and place of OUR choosing. This place is usually at my female accomplice’s apartment. Why? When we make arrangements to meet, we convince the target that it is better for us to meet at my FB’s apartment and go out as a “troika”. In this part of the world, that means, “threesome” so subliminally she is being programmed for a three-way. Additionally, meeting at a female’s apartment is non-threatening and puts the target at ease. We want her to be TOTALLY relaxed and mentally in CONDITION WHITE.
When the target comes to the apartment, we always have TWO bottles of wine, one chilled and the other warm. We always sit on the couch with my female accomplice IN BETWEEN the target and me. She will always sit with her left arm around me while sitting with her legs SLIGHTLY open and TOWARDS the target. During the conversation, she constantly rubs my neck and will touch herself on the breasts and thighs, in a very subtle manner. Periodically she will reach out and touch the target’s knee, hand or face. This is designed to build SEXUAL TENSION. When the target begins to respond, my accomplice will abruptly stand-up and say, “Wow! It’s getting hot in here! Let’s go out before something happens!” (Take Away) As we are getting our coats on, she will pick-up the SECOND bottle of wine and say, “Damn this one’s warm! I'll put it in the refrigerator so it will be cold when we come back later. That’s ok with you, isn't it?” She says to the target. (Leading and preparing the target).
We take the target to dance clubs and all dance together gradually dancing with the target sandwiched in between me and her, with my hands on the targets hips from behind and my female placing her arms over the target's shoulders. Whenever my accomplice tries to say something to me, I push into the target and all of over mouths are forced together. If I kiss my partner, the target is RIGHT THERE to see it. I always kiss the target on the cheek after I kiss my partner. My partner ALWAYS follows suit. This not only escalates sexual tension, but also is an IOI. If she doesn't pull away, she is DEFINITELY interested in the possibility of bringing this game to the next level. My partner at the appropriate time will suggest going back to her apartment for that “delicious bottle of wine”…
When we get back to her apartment, we position ourselves the same as before, but this time we work-up to heavy kino, deep kissing and petting in front of the target. Then my PARTNER pulls the girl into the set, NOT ME! THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT! I know it goes totally against the whole Alpha Male Theory, but at this stage, YOU MUST LET THE FEMALE INITIATE SEXUAL CONTACT WITH THE MARK! You may have been to some swingers clubs. If not, I recommend that you go to “Club Paradise” or “Showboat” in Amsterdam and observe the interaction of couples and single females into the swing-scene. You will find that if a single male or male part of a couple tries to initiate anything with a single female or a female part of a couple, HE WILL FAIL 99% of the time. Why? Because he is a threat! There’s something primordial about the mechanics of this and I really don't understand it, but he will most likely fail, EVEN WHEN HE IS PART OF A COUPLE. HOWEVER, when the female part of the couple initiates sexual contact with another female, F2F sex occurs 90% of the time and the lucky male part of the couple has FF2M sex at least 95% of the time. Plus if you go to one of these clubs with an HB, you WILL BE APPROACHED for sex, NOT FLUFF, by other HB’s no matter what you look like! Social proof lives at swinger’s clubs!
Anyway, my partner pulls the target into the set by doing a multitude of things. Sometimes she tells the target that she has such beautiful hair and starts to touch her hair. She pulls the target GENTLY towards her and tells her to lay her head down on her lap, so that she can massage her hair AND face. (kino escalation). While my partner is massaging the target’s hair and face, she begins to kiss me so that the mark can see it. She will start talking OUT LOUD about how soft the target’s hair and skin are and tell me to “feel for myself”. THIS IS CRITICAL MASS TIME! ALWAYS SAY TO THE target, “That’s ok with you, isn't it?” YOU MUST ASK FOR HER PERMISSION TO TOUCH HER!!!! Again, I know this goes against the Alpha Male Theory, but you need to get her to relax if you want to have sex with her. You can prove to her that you are Alpha while you are fucking her, especially when your partner is verbally reinforcing that to the target as you penetrating her! The kino escalates to groping, 3 way kissing and finally FFM sex. Once our target only wanted to kiss and watch us have sex while she played with herself. That’s fine with us too! It’s still fun and exciting anyway you look at it!
This entire “ Sexual Serial Killers” game takes time, coordination and planning, BUT IT HAS A VERY HIGH CHANCE A PAYOFF when you choose your target carefully and execute your operation with military precision! Think about how much time we waste fluffing bitches at clubs. It’s fun when you’re new to the game, but, to me at almost 44 years old, it’s become boring! One of the “33 Ancient Chinese Strategies” was entitled: “KILL WITH A BORROWED SWORD”. It involves letting someone else do your dirty work for you. This game makes the woman do all the fluffing and donkey work for you. All you are there for is the ride……….
There are so many ways women attract other women it makes ME JEALOUS sometimes!
None of the girls that we have approached have been alone. You very seldom see a female at a club alone - they are usually in pairs. If you noticed in the above report, my girl always PICKS the target and I always OPEN the set with my fake AFC approach. My girl always CLOSES the set with the fake "thanks for helping him, he's SOOOO perfect for me" routine and setS UP the day two. My female is an ACTIVE HUNTER in this routine, NOT a pawn or a pivot! THIS IS the fundamental difference between the SSK Routine and other methods where you use the female to gain SP. The SSK routine creates TENSION within the target, (when she thinks that you are getting ready, AFC style to approach her), BURSTS her bubble when you ask her help in getting another chick outside her set, INCREASES YOUR SP EXPONENTIALLY when the OTHER girl approaches the target and tells the target how wonderful you are, DISARMS and DESTROYS any BITCH SHIELD that the target may have put up and virtually GUARANTEES a Day Two because now there is a "sisterly" connection between the two chicks and the FEMALE IS NO THREAT TO THE TARGET! Just remember that BOTH OF YOU must deliver this routine SMOOTHLY and CONVINCINGLY! If you don't, it won't work!
Mark B.:
Being a student and a natural practitioner of the game, I am always trying to educate myself on he viccitudes of male-female relations. Recently while at my aunt's house I noticed a book called "Why Men Marry Some Women and Not Others." So I picked it up and started reading. Although the book is written for women, it's unique in the sense that the advice contained within is based on statistical studies and empirical data collected from recently married men and women, but mostly men, based on why they chose to marry a certain woman at some point in their lives.
One of the most interesting facts presented there was that most men tend to marry or choose one women when they feel that somehow their options become limited and they do not have the same level of success with women they used to have. For example, after being a player for years one guy found and married a woman after he gained some weight and began losing his hair, but nonetheless still frequented the same old bar. He said his need to marry became clear to him after he offered to buy a drink to some hottie, who openly laughed in his face and called him an old man. When he persisted she raised her voice and humiliated him in front of the nearby crowd.
I could not help but chuckle a bit when I read this because I see this happen all the time, especially with some guys I have gone out with, who look obviously out of place with respect to the women they approach. While the women are slim, hot and tanned, these guys are average soft and pale, yet they don't understand how these hot women don't go for them due to their personality or something else. There is an obvious mismatch in terms of physical standard, especially with respect to hot women who frequent nightclubs and get a lot of attention from all sorts of men and can afford to be choosy.
Some guys just don't get that when a woman is interested and open she is and when she is not she is not. When she is, she opens up, her eyes glaze over and she responds. When she is not, she shuts down and can be cruel to the highest degree and no amount of negging or challenging or other crap can turn her around.
So what does this mean for the average guy? First, to me, it means get yourself in the best possible shape you can, go to the gym and bust your balls with bone crushing workouts. Lose you gut and your second chin or if already a bone rack put on some meat on that coat hanger. If pale go to a tanning salon. A good tan can add 2-3 points to anyone's attractiveness. Get a decent haircut, and get clear skin. Eat a cleaner, healthier diet - from my study The South Beach Diet is one of the best.
Then go to places to meet women where it's obvious that women do not get a lot of attention from men, such as coffee shops, book stores, malls, etc. There a guy can define himself significantly because she can focus on him, instead of having to focus on 500 other guys and other distractions. His chances improve dramatically.
What about the prototypical short bald fat guy who has the hot chick under his arm? First of all having dated a dancer for 3.5 years I discovered that may dancers, hot chicks within themselves, deliberately chose to "date" some short bald fat guy because they knew that he would not leave her, would dode over her, buy her things, take her out and support her financially because he had little other choice, and she knew it. All he needed to keep going was a kiss on the cheek goodbye or maybe a hand job here and there. Having seen this over and over I realized these are facade relationships based on the outward appearance of him having her when in fact he does not, because when their "date" ends she calls her hot young lover, drives to his house and has him bone her brains out while they laugh at the short fat bald guy and the money she got out of him. There is so much more to things than meet the eye.
The above is a cynical view, no doubt but I believe it's important to have a healthy, realistic outlook in order to do the real things that garner and bring in success.
PUA looking for wingmen in the Vancouver, BC area; please email funnypua@yahoo.ca
A guru master:
Just had the strangest evening. Girls really *are* sexual predators. It's TRUE.
The way I dress now, girls approach me alot more than they used to. I wear these really cool boots, ripped jeans, spiked hair, EYELINER, yes, I wear eyeliner. Anywayz, so I'm out by myself in the city, just walking around, and decide to sit down on a bench to relax and have a smoke, when these two HB7 girls walk by and go, OH HE THINKS HE'S SO COOL WITH RIPPED JEANS! I'm like, Glad you approve. So I chat them for a bit (and they had *beer*) so I invited myself over.
We get to the chicks' apartment and go out on the balcony. I just sit there, aloof, and use very little game on them. I think I used like four routines the whole night. BTW, I had an epiphany about game last week: Only game on girls and pummel them with routines if they perceive themselves to be hotter or cooler than me. Otherwise, I just sit back and let them do all the work. This may seem elementary to you guys, but I have oversold myself many, many times and lost MANY lays.
So were out on the balcony, and the girls start COMPETING over me, and qualifying themselves as if they were lameass AFCs. I just sat back and pretended to be impressed while the two of them competed, gave each other dirty looks, bragged about breast size, blowjob abilities, and even how much money their parents make; they put each other down, argued, and backturned each other, over and over. Every once in a while I'd have to go, LADIES...ladies...we're all friends here, (and then use a routine to change their state). I also did alot of playing innocent, like I don't know what's going on..
This went on for FOUR HOURS. I had no intention of fucking these girls, as I already have three LTRS and I am not about to cheat on them with SEVENS.
I just stayed for the validation of seeing how far they would go, and I seriously thought they were going to start beating each other up right then and there. Also, I can't remember the last time girls kissed my ass like this.
So after four hours, I take the girls cell and go to the bathroom for some privacy (to call my GF). They're like, FUCK YOU, you're calling your GF, what a fucking asshole, you stupid fucking player, you probably have ten girls on the side, you PRICK... and on and on... I couldn't call my GF under these conditions so I start grabbing my shit to leave, which was fucking funny because they would not let me go. They would beg me to stay, then call me a fucking asshole, then apologize, then back to hating me, JUMPING on me and holding me down like a prisoner, saying sorry, offering me a massage, then right back to freak-hating me again.
FINALLY I'm like, LOOK, if I was your boyfriend wouldn't you want me to leave this situation and come home to YOU...
BUT DOES LOGIC mean anything to women who are in this state?... hell no.
Anyway, they fucked me over, because I had to catch the last subway and they deliberately told me to turn LEFT on my way out instead of RIGHT... So I missed the last subway and had to walk for an hour to get to my GFs house.
Rod:
Long story short I met this gal a 2 weeks ago and really hit it off with her. Tons of energy, wild, uninhibited and a great body. Things were going well and she claimed to be way into me with comments like, "I've never waited by the phone before for a call but tonight I was I just could help it." "You are amazing you do so many cool things..." (I am rather eclectic in my interests) so on and so forth.
As an aside I like the David DeAngelo style of attracting women because it fits my personality best. Cocky & funny is pretty much natural to me, and after exposure to David's ideas I just modified my behavior slightly and I found the change pretty easily. She likes to smoke pot while I don't like it. She's been trying to get me to smoke with her and so far I refused. She's a vegetarian so I told her if she eats a steak dinner with me I'd smoke pot with her. Anyways, she was constantly testing me with shit tests and I finally broke her down with a comment. She said, "You should smoke pot with me, it'd make you cool." (This was a throwback to a joke I had made earlier about me not being cool)
I said sweetly, "Baby, if I got any cooler I'd have to leave you and find a woman more my own caliber." She was floored. Even several hours later she brought up that comment and admitted she was still reeling.
So things were going well.
Now to the heart of the matter...I find it extremely difficult to find women that I enjoy spending more than a few hours with. I suppose I get bored easily. This gal is unique in that I can spend as much time as I'd like with her and not get tired of her. I've only met maybe 2 or 3 other women I could say that about in my lifetime. Anyways, we were supposed to go camping this weekend we were to leave on Friday. On Wednesday she called me and we made plans to go out to see a band on Thursday. She said she'd call me after she was done with work to iron out the details to get together on Thursday and I would explain the plan for Friday's camping trip to her.
She gets off of work at 5 I figured I'd hear from her by 6. Well, 8:00 rolls around (the band finishes playing at 9:00) and I finally accepted that I got stood up. I ran some errands and still hadn't heard from her by 9:30. This is Thursday we were supposed to leave for the camping trip Friday after work.
So around 9:30 I called this other gal I know who I haven't seen for a few months (she lives out of town but on the way to my camp site) and invited her camping. She accepted so it's nice to have backup women.
Now the question. Being as I haven't had a flake like this for a while, and I was never all that good dealing with it before I'd like some suggestions.
Optimally, I'd like to continue to see her and not have to deal with this flaking shit anymore. Currently I reckon when I talk to her again (if she doesn't call soon then I will call her when I return from the camping trip) I will casually explain that standing me up is a big pet peeve and if she does it again within 6 months, she's done. I'll also figure on a way to let her know that I went with another gal and still had fun without her. I'd be interested in any other suggestions you list readers may have.
As it stands I haven't talked to her since Wednesday when we made plans for Thursday and she never called as she was supposed to.
New update...
So the gal that flaked on me called me up on my cell (which I normally only use for work, not for personal things) about 1 PM today and left a voice mail saying she lost her cell phone and my number was stored in there and she still really wanted to go camping. By this point I had already made plans with girl #2.
So I wound up calling her back and saying, sorry, I've already made other plans. She asked what I was doing I said, "I'm going camping." She said, "Oh, you're going with someone else." She said this a bit accusingly. I told her that I had waited around for her until 9:30 last night and she never called me and that was plenty of time and I had to line up my weekend. So sorry, but I have something really fun we can do next week...so we made plans for next week.
So that's the story with my flaking woman. She said she wound up going to the concert anyways figuring I may have gone but she looked and I wasn't there. She considered dropping by but, "I'm not going to just show up at your house unannounced." Ha ha ha. I told her I appreciated her consideration in that regard.
If anyone replies to this please CC: a copy of your e-mail directly to me at munchie_068@yahoo.com
Papa:
FR: The Seduction of Paris Hilton (Part II: Paris Kisses Papa):
So I am at home wondering what I should do for the night as I am home alone for the first time since I've been at Project Hollywood, which really sucked. Suddenly, I am startled out of my moping with a real emotional roller-coaster as I receive a phone call from Playboy.
Deep6 walks into the room.
. (said as a nervous joke). . Suddenly, Paris splits away from her group, walks into the restaurant, and appears to be talking on her cell phone. Paris is wearing a simple, yet pretty, blue dress. She looks at me from inside the restaurant through a window; then, she heads into the bathroom.
She was taking too long so I walk towards the entrance of the restaurant near the window, and pretend that I am on my cell phone talking so it looks like I am not just waiting for her. Suddenly, she comes out and I hear Paris talking to a waiter near the kitchen.
I immediately get up, walk past the waitress, stop, and open her. As I open her, I pivot, start the conversation, and open her over the shoulder, and slowly face her as I engage in the conversation. She stops walking, turns around and listens with a calm body-posture and a relaxed smile.
PROMOS & REVIEWS SECTION (there are NO paid ads in this list and never have been. The "commercial" section is distinguished by the "--------------" separators):
Please send them to him at david@be-relentless.com. I would recommend you copy me as well (cliff@cliffslist.com) so I will make sure they get answered.
All subscribers of these emails will be given a free subscription and, as here, you can unsubscribe at any time. I know that you will find his comments and advice to be pretty unique and very useful. We are also making progress on the long awaited book which we hope will be ready relatively soon now.
The tapes of the David Seminar are now available and are being shipped upon receipt of your order, but please allow 4-6 weeks for delivery. You can visit the website at www.be-relentless.com and orders should be made through paypal (go to www.paypal.com and send money to sales@be-relentless.com) if you need some other way to make payment, inquire at info@be-relentless.com. This product comes on two DVD discs for a total of approximately 6 1/2 hours of playing time. The price is $230 USD + $20 USD for the DVD which covers shipping and handling anywhere in the world. Inquire about shipping by overnight courier. These tapes are now available in a sound only version also.
Private in person or telephone consultations with David are available. David is particularly intuitive with regard to your specific individual problems with certain women. You can get on the phone, answer his questions on the situation, and he will give you very insightful advice on how to succeed in your particular mission.
PLEASE NOTE: This David is not to be confused with David DeAngelo of www.doubleyourdating.com (who has posted some great stuff here under the name "Sisonpyh"), or David Shade (of www.davidshade.com).
LAIR SECTION (Lairs are gatherings of PUA's of differing levels and talents that meet in different cities to discuss their experiences and to work together to improve their success with women):
LAIR SECTION: This archived letter used to contain a list of local lairs (lairs are gatherings of PUA's of differing levels and talents that meet in different cities to discuss their experiences and to work together to improve their success with women); as many have been created or have stopped existing (or contacts have changed), we now refer our readers to the up-do-date worlwide lair listings.
Blake Richards has put out a new ebook that looks very interesting. Check it out here: www.social-mastery.com/Game.html
Anyone interested in attending their seminars and/or workshops, email Papa at papa@realsocialdynamics.com with the subject "WORKSHOP" and mention that you heard about it from Cliff's List. Also note: RSD will consider working out payment plans to make their workshop affordable - mention this to them.
Real Social Dynamics (realsocialdynamics.directtrack.com/ad/1/CD11 ):
Learn what works in seminar, and then jump directly into the field and watch the instructors demonstrate and teach it live. Stop feeling the fear of not knowing what to do ...
Schedule:
Classroom Seminars ($200 deposit required for signup)
Amsterdam Seminar - $300 - August 28-29, 2004
London Seminar - $300 - September 4-5, 2004
Melbourne Seminar - $300 - October 15-16, 2004
Sydney Seminar - $300 - October 22-23, 2004
New York Seminar - $300 - November 12-13, 2004
San Francisco - $300 - December 3-4, 2004
In-Field Workshops ($200 deposit required for signup)
Amsterdam Workshop - $600 - August 27-29, 2004
London Workshop - SOLD OUT - $600 - September 3-5, 2004
London Workshop - $600 - September 9-11, 2004
Melbourne Workshop - $600 - October 14-16, 2004
Sydney Workshop - $600 - October 21-23, 2004
New York Workshop - $600 - November 11-13, 2004
San Francisco Workshop - $600 - December 2-4, 2004
Individualized Boot-Camps ($200 deposit required for signup)
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - July 16-18, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - July 23-25, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - July 30-August 1, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - August 6-8, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - September 17-19, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - September 24-26, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - October 1-3, 2004
Los Angeles Bootcamp - $1500 - October 8-10, 2004
Go to realsocialdynamics.directtrack.com/ad/1/CD11 to signup for these events on their schedule.
What method are YOU using?
s: 2-sets, 3-sets, mixed sets, etc) of people with the 3 second rule by stacking indirect openers (including false opinion openers), false time constraining (discovered by Style), demonstrating a higher value to your romantic interest’s peer group with high octane DHVs while she obliquely observes (locking her into her own set with a prop), and simultaneously performing false disqualifiers (which include negs) on her with the intension of disarming her peergroup and then isolating her to rebuild her self-esteem once you have enough IOIs (indicators of interest) so you may share in a comfort and trust building effort and then build in a jealousy subplot to solidify her attraction for you, you are using The Mystery Method.
If instead you are only approaching women who are alone, you are greatly limiting your options and quite likely alienating your target's friends. Do you want a lonely woman (why is she lonely?) or a woman who already has a healthy social lfe? Truth is, healthy women have healthy relationships ... sometimes good friendships with guys. Like it or not, you will have to meet these women with men in her group.
Women of beauty are rarely found alone. Don't miss the opportunity to meet and attract them WITH social proof from her very own peergroup. Group Approach Theory (GAT - created by me) improves your options and increases the chances for attraction DRAMATICALLY over Single Approach Theory (SAT).
The guys who are GREAT in this game KNOW that they can improve their game ten-fold through seminars and personal coaching in-field workshops. Think about this: Why did so many of the greats who use my GAT (Style, Tyler D., MTL_PUA, and others) take my seminars and workshops? What started them off to greatness in this game? Can you see the co-relation may in fact be a causation?
If you have NEVER taken a seminar or workshop before, it's time to finally reconsider. They are life-transforming. I have conducted dozens of them. I am currently conducting a bootcamp and will accept only 5 people. Workshops and seminars were for many of the greats THE difference between great success and failure. If you are ready, give me a call and sign up. If you have any questions, give me a shout at 323-219-8696 (Mystery) because email sucks, or visit www.Mysterymethod.com and email me your #. We need to talk. Man to man.
Swinggcat has published a new ebook which you can check out at his website at www.realworldseduction.com. Those of you who remember his outstanding posts here will be anxious to get this as soon as possible. Highly recommended.
Schedule 2004
Location Dates
London, England September 3, 4, 5
Speed Life Seminars
Schedule 2004
Location Dates
Cancun, Mexico November 7 thru 13
Your Mind in Business
Schedule 2004
Location Dates
Dallas, TX June 21-25
Cliff's Comment: MONTREAL!!!!
*Introduction To Hypnosis -- The New Curriculum -- Las Vegas September 20-24
This year we were asked by a national hypnosis group to develop a New Curriculum for the training of hypnotists -- one which would reflect the absolute best of what has always worked while incorporating our own cutting-edge discoveries. We wanted a curriculum that was so comprehensive in explication and exercise that the graduates could walk into an internship anywhere in the world, secure that they were the best-trained hypnotists in the place. The result is being rolled out over five days in Las Vegas. This is your chance to immerse yourself in the most comprehensive approach to powerful, positive, permanent change ever presented!
Send mail to Cassi@trucor.com with questions or comments about these seminars.
Call to register: 419 882-8543 or go to www.trucor.com
Double Your Dating LIVE! NEW Seminar! We will be reviewing all of the new DYD products here soon, including the monthly interview series in which David DeAngelo interviews "Dating Gurus" such as Ben, David X, and many others.
2004 Tentative Seminar Schedule:
London, England, July.
New York September.
Las Vegas beginning of December.
You can order all your DYD products and register for seminars through this link: www.doubleyourdating.com/cl
s, many from start to close (finish). And that's a full "close" by the way, not just an email address or phone number!
The seminar is held in conjunction with Ross Jeffries Speed Seduction Seminars. Ross's seminar is during the day (and Riker presents at that too) and then Riker does his seminar in the evening. And even if you do not attend Ross's seminar you can still attend Riker's.
For full details see the web page at: http://www.daveriker.com/logseminar/track/cl.htm (site is either inactive or no longer relevant)
Be sure to check out his "Reviews" page on his site. Many guys that have been in the game for a while, and attended a LOT of seminars, were just blown away by Riker's Log seminar.
from Zagreb who has spent almost 4 years in the game. He is also a respected poster in Mystery's lounge.
To see some of his stuff, search for posts by "croBadboy" on mASF or read one of the recent issues of Cliff's list.
Workshops are 1 on 1 for 3 days.
Each day consists of a 4-hour seminar and 5 hours of active in-field work. Each night you will make 20-30 approaches with your teacher to get field experience. 1 on 1 training makes it possible to answer any questions you might have and cover the most important aspects of the game in detail. Teachings are tailored to your level in the game.
The basic structure of the workshop is:
How to dress, peacocking vs. dressing style
Alpha-male body language secrets
Attitude (inner-game) and getting a good seductive voice
Difference between emotional and party type girls
Social dynamics in clubs (2sets/3sets/lonewolves), know your city
Openers (sets with males vs. only-girl sets)
alone and with a wing
Different tools for getting attraction
Power of contrast (bad boy & nice guy in one)
Stealing their frames
Passing sh*t tests
Push-pull
Isolation tactics (2 steps)
tactics (the AMOG handshake, group set AMOG destroyers)
Boyfriend destroyers
Passing LMR
Secrets of good sex
How to manage a good relationship
More body language secrets
How to turn Coffee dates into fuck-fest in just 1 hour
How to turn a 0$ date into a time she will never forget
Difference between PUing in different places (small towns, big cities, colleges and the difference between certain clubs and the girls who go there)
Badboy says he can write a pages of what he does with guys because it's not just PU. He opens their EYES to LIFE, to understand how to live successfully.
For more info, email Badboy at badboy@playboylifestyle.net. See Badboy's new website: www.playboylifestyle.net
NEW BADBOY WORKSHOPS IN RIO DE JANEIRO:
The dates are:
August 5-6-7
August 12-13-14
August 19-20-21
There are seats available now.
Price : $850
You can make a deposit ($100) for a workshop on Paypal and send money to: nightlife@playboylifestyle.net
Also a good way to keep up with things without having to navigate mASF. Drop By TSL today! www.thundercatseductionlair.com
The Art of Approaching: Learn to meet ANY woman, ANY time, ANY where. The most difficult hurdle for most men to overcome is that of the initial Approach. This comprehensive eBook gives you over 35 unique Openers, as well as a step-by-step roadmap to help overcome your fear of approaching forever!
www.thundercatseductionlair.com/ebook.htm
Sanek has a new website up at fybb.eluid.org
Check it out and see his comments.
The workshops include:
- Basejump: For approach newbies who need to get internal game and basic attraction skills in gear
- Field Interaction: To perfect your bar/ club and street performance
- Solid Game: Everything good except lots of flakes? Few end results? End to end game sticking points covered…
For more information go to www.impactinteraction.com or contact them @ contact@impactinteraction.com.
* How do I get women to WANT to sleep with me? After all, what good are all those "bedroom techniques" I learned if I don't even know how to get her back to my bedroom in the first place?
* Why do women melt around some guys, but they are totally unresponsive to me? What do they have that I don't?
Wouldn't it be nice if you knew a guaranteed way to "get physical" with any woman you go out with? Have you ever been on a date with a woman, and wondered *how* you can start "making out" with her? (by making out, I mean kissing, hugging, holding hands, etc.)
Jason King has just released a not new report that will teach you everything you need to know about getting *close* to a woman on a date.
Jason is an absolute master at making out with a woman on the first date. Whenever he goes out with a woman, he seems to put them under some kind of "love spell", and they want to make out with him more and more as the date progresses. By the end of the date, the women usually invent all kinds of excuses to invite him back to their place.
There is NO other person out there who is teaching these skills. If you've ever wanted to learn how to make out with a woman on the FIRST date... not weeks or months later... you MUST check out his site.
journal up on livejournal. Right now it's mostly just a record of my sarges--but comments are welcome.
www.livejournal.com/users/maximillianhell
Visit these sites (and give me your comments on their products):
http://www.sexualrapportmodeling.com/jump.php?a=2350 (site is either inactive or no longer relevant)
Daniel:
If you are looking for a wing and you are a guy from Romania, you can check on our forums at www.seductierapida.ro/forum and you might find one.
Ben:
Ben has a system and set of Tarot Cards that he his going to be launching soon. Find out more at his website.
P.S. Try magic words 'ben' 'rap' and 'nlp'.
Mike PilinskI is the author of "Without Embarrassment: The Social Coward's Totally Fearless Seduction System"... a unique method of meeting girls that will have you making up for wasted time spent living in shy-guy hell from the very first moment you test it out. Check it Out Here: www.highstatusmale.com/.
David Wygant (www.whatsyourexcuse.com & www.mydatingagent.com).
Erick Kand has a new website that showcases Hypnosis Stage Shows for fun and entertainment: www.HypnosisEvents.com
davidc@howtosucceedwithwomen.com
HOW TO SUCCEED WITH WOMEN Ron Louis and David Copeland have their Mastery Program Tape series available. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes. howtosucceedwithwomen.com/
There are also going to be awesome guest speakers at the seminar:
Smooth, the President of the Toronto Lair, will lend his rich experience and expertise in several areas, including real seductions of hotties online. There will also be another awesome dude at the seminar - he goes by the name of Scorpeus, his story and transformation into a PUA is inspiring in itself, and he will share his insights as well.
To learn more about this special seminar, go to:
And follow the "Seminars" link.
And if you haven't downloaded my eBook, "The Dating Wizard: Secrets to Success with Women", then that's the place to get started.
Inside, I explain step-by-step how to approach women, how to get instant dates, how to get physical, and how to sustain her interest if you desire a relationship. Best of all, you won't have to be a jerk to OUTDO the jerks!
Download it now at:
And follow the link to "About The Dating Wizard"
1. Trance Words
2. Rapport
3. Persuasion Anchoring
4. Pacing, &
5. Leading
Although less than halfway through, members are reporting some highly entertaining, and some startling, success stories. The UltimateSeduction group has the advantage of having more than a few women on-list, enabling members to get some very pointed straight talk on their techniques. There is nothing to memorize - only a handful of very simple, and very effective, techniques. The group is gaining about 200 new members a week and is lightly moderated.
Anyone may join the tutorial at: groups.yahoo.com/group/UltimateSeduction/
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