I like you enough that I'll let you stay with another girl
This is Cliff's Private List, a free e-mail relating to seduction. Your contributions of articles, field reports, reviews and other comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from people commenting are separated by HHHHHH with each commentator's name preceding each comment. Comments from previous emails are preceded by an ">", usually in front of that commentator's name). Feel free to forward this email to all your friends and encourage them to request a free subscription by going to http://www.cliffslist.com and click on "Subscribe." You can also unsubscribe on the site as well. If you would like to be added to the free joke list (and mention if you do not want to receive the adult emails that come with the joke list), send an email to cliff@cliffslist.com. All posts you see here have been submitted by the author, or permission granted by the author to be reposted here. All emails with comments should be sent to cliff@cliffslist.com. If you are reading this as an email, you want to go to http://www.cliffslist.com and see the entire email, which includes Lair listings (see if there is one in your city or start one if there isn't), promotional notices, seminar notices, new product and website announcements - and lots more. This email has been edited and modified to allow it to pass through the various email filters - the unedited version is on the website.
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DID YOU MISS THE 2005 ASSEMBLY OF PICK UP ARTISTS, LADIES MEN, & DATING EXPERTS? You are in luck!!
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PROMOS:
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Michael (http://www.thedatingwizard.com):
THE DEEPEST LEVELS OF ATTRACTION
Attraction is not a static thing. That's the truth.
A woman is either feeling more and more of it
for you, or she is feeling less and less.
It NEVER stays the same.
So you have to ask yourself a question:
Which do you prefer, a woman feeling she is
"settling" for you for "practical" reasons and
her attraction thus eroding for you day by day,
or a woman feeling that she MUST HAVE you?
In the real world, attraction doesn't care about
the politically correct b.s. definition of it.
Ultimately, REAL attraction feels like a NEED,
it's not some kind of thing that is "nice" to
have. It feels as if you NEED it.
THAT'S what attraction is.
When you feel MASSIVE ATTRACTION for
a woman, it's not some kind of, "oh that is
nice" feeling. It's A HECK OF A LOT
more than that. And THAT'S what you want
women to feel for you.
So, if you are going to actually make a woman
FEEL this level of attraction, you have to first
understand just where the BAR is in terms of
what IS a confident secure fun intriguing guy.
Because of the ocean of guys who still kiss
up to women, her mind's default setting is set
to politely and quickly vaporize all guys who
approach her. The only way you are going
to overpower that setting is if your behaviour
and style clearly and immediately indicate that
there is something very different about you,
in a cool way.
I want to put an END to any notion that you
can get the kind of results you want with only
a half-assed attitude about this stuff.
It's really important to realize the full REALITY
of an attractive woman.
The REALITY of having infinite guys WORSHIP
her and willing to SERVE her and TAKE abuse
from her. And the EFFECT that has on a woman
in terms of what is attractive to her. You have to
be in the same reality to understand it, which is
what actually ultimately happens when you get
good at this stuff.
Guys keep giving WOMEN what GUYS
would want, in the typical guys' frame of
scarcity and desperation.
But this is like giving SALTY PRETZELS
instead of water to a man dying of THIRST,
and then wondering why he doesn't seem
to appreciate it.
Women are EMOTIONALLY DYING OF THIRST
for some masculine confidence, wit, humor, and
leadership, as well as for some sexual tension,
unpredictability, intrigue, fun, and excitement.
Instead, guys are giving women the opposite,
because as guys they want assurance, permanence,
and reliability, since they have been dunked in
the matrix illusion of "scarcity of women" and
the matrix illusion that as men they don't have
the same intrinsic worth in society as women.
And even when guys DO hear solid advice,
such as "be like women" in the sense of being
hard to get, guys do it wrong, because they are
doing it with the wrong INTENT.
They are doing it almost with a sense of
ANGER. As if they are "getting back"
at women, as if it's tit for tat.
IT'S NOT ABOUT THAT AT ALL.
When you do it like that, you are totally
INCONGRUENT with what attraction
IS.
Attraction is about SUPERIORITY.
How the heck can someone who is
SUPERIOR get UPSET at someone
INFERIOR?
Does the GENERAL worry about the
remarks of some guy ranked as just
a private?
That's why although attraction ultimately
IS about perceived superiority, the irony is
that to ACHIEVE this EFFECTIVELY,
you have to not even FEEL there is a power
gap between you and a woman to begin with.
Otherwise, your emotions will give you away
in infinite micro expressions and forms
of body language, and your emotions will
betray you by the way you live your life.
She will see that you are actually bitter, etc.
Remember, the REAL power of attraction
rests in its SUBTLETIES, from the way you
dress, to the comfort you have with being
sexual, to the sense of humor you have,
to the way your voice projects, to the very
way you MOVE.
Think about it: When you are totally under
control and relaxed and confident, you
speak and move with less hurried rush
and you never run out of "things to say" .
In fact, it seems bizarre to even worry of
"having things to say". You start to realize
that your secure, inspired, or fun mood is
what is fueling your ability to have a great
conversation, enabling you to access all
the parts of your mind that give you infinite
"material".
You also start to realize that this vibe you
are giving off results in "energy-return"
from the woman, as you and her ping-pong
the energy/vibes/conversation back and
forth, each of you enjoying this interaction.
So if you saw a woman you were interested
in, you wouldn't feel it's some kind of
RACE or some kind of CONTEST.
You would roll up casual and laid back, and
your conversation wouldn't be about trying
to MAKE anything happen, but rather about
reflecting your inner vibes, mood, state, etc.
One of the most important elements of high level
"game" is simply a byproduct of who you ARE.
Once you are ARE in the right state, quality "game"
is the uninterrupted flow of your own mood and
energy outwards.
Quality "game" however is ALSO about
understanding some important things about
women and female culture so that you
understand the real critical issues they need
to know that you are aware of, and quality
"game" is ALSO about understanding
HUMAN EMOTION in general, including
YOUR OWN emotions.
The result of quality "game" is that you
wouldn't be afraid to say something
NICE to a woman when you FELT it, but
you would also not be NEEDY for a woman
who was hot, so complimenting her on her
LOOKS would instinctively not be the first
thing that you did. This idea of not kissing
up to a woman based on her looks would
be instinctive to you, you would not even
feel the emotional desire or impulse to
focus too much on her looks. It's the
neediness and scarcity and lack of
perspective that creates these wrong
behaviours in the first place.
And if you saw she was really into you, which
she most likely would be as a result of all this,
you wouldn't feel the need to ROB HER
of the pleasure of WONDERING about you,
(which is what needy guys do out of their fear
of losing her) of the pleasure of not knowing
everything about you, and of the pleasure
of wondering if she "had" you or not.
You would UNDERSTAND that once you are
secure in your own value, it's actually FUN
to not know right away that you "have" someone,
and yet you would also know how far to push
this and not to push this into the realm of the
absurd, cruel, or just plain dorkyish.
In fact, ALL of attraction FLOWS from the
way you THINK, which is based on the way
you see yourself and the world.
Let me give you a real life example, of
how REAL CONFIDENCE in your
value is reflected POWERFULLY
and instinctively.
This example actually took YEARS for me
to fully realize the full effect of.
I remember a girl from many years ago,
before I got into this stuff. A girl who
I felt I was "lucky" to be with at the time.
Even though I was getting mistreated,
I thought I was "lucky" because I had fallen
under the brainwashing spell of society
to believe that a woman who was attractive
was scarce, (which isn't even true at all) and
that men had to "work" to "prove themselves"
to women, because women were "innocent"
while men were just sex-hungry animals.
Anyway, not to get into a whole life-story
here, I remember once waking up a BIT
to the reality of what was going on,
but still not GETTING it enough to
rise from the ashes of that life. But I
had managed to come to the conclusion
that her behaviour wasn't very good,
even though I thought I was still "lucky"
to have her because most guys I knew
couldn't get an equally hot woman
EVER.
Anyway, I basically confronted her with
the fact her behaviour was pretty
atrocious, and politely told her that
after I stripped away the attraction
I felt for her, I honestly couldn't think
of one reason I was with her. I
WANTED to have a reason, and I
even said something like "what are
the good things about you?"
(And of course, by this time, she
had already taken the power for
granted, so this was interpreted
by her not as challenging her, but
as me HOPING for goodness.)
Well, her response was a calm:
"Not much."
This had a profound effect on me,
causing reverberations of learning
that lasted with me for years.
I remember at the time, feeling all this
ANGER, and yet, there was NOTHING
I could do, for, after all, she was not
trying to resist my argument that she
was no good.
In fact, by DOING THIS, she was actually
INDIRECTLY saying "I don't NEED to
prove myself, and I don't CARE to
either. And, in fact, I AM good for nothing
EXCEPT the ONE THING THAT COUNTS-
i.e. ATTRACTION."
And it was very spontaneous.
When was the last time a woman asked
YOU something about yourself and your
reply was that you weren't good for much?
You see, on the SURFACE it sounds like
self-deprecation. And I don't recommend
it for beginners, because beginners are usually
SO congruent with INFERIOR beliefs, that
when they say a self-deprecating comment,
it will be taken SERIOUSLY to mean
inferiority.
But once you GET IT, internally, and your
body language, tonality, lifestyle, and
BEHAVIORS show that you know that
indeed you are VERY desirable, well
if you THEN were to say you were worth
"nothing much" in RESPONSE to
a woman TRYING to get you to
prove your worth to her, the results
would be powerful as hell.
Because you are saying all the right things
about yourself. Now, this doesn't mean
to be abusive, i.e. if a woman is REALLY
feeling HURT by you, and she asks
you what is the good side of you, etc.
Don't be a bastard at a time like that.
But you have to understand the UNDERLYING
message here, which is your BELIEFS about
yourself create your BEHAVIOURS.
The answer of "nothing much" was an
EMOTIONAL communication.
The kind that is EFFECTIVE.
Not the useless kind that is LOGICAL.
At the time, I honestly felt that she really
couldn't help it, i.e. that this was her REAL
personality, but that she still had value.
And I couldn't figure this out at the time.
I figured this was just her personality.
Until one day I couldn't take it anymore.
I finally came to the conclusion that
NO WOMAN on earth was worth
being with if I couldn't get some
basic level respect. Even if it "wasn't
her fault".
So I didn't get angry, I actually
REALLY thought that this girl
was useless to me, because her
attractiveness was no longer
worth it, and even though she
"couldn't help it" I figured that
it wasn't my job to be her therapist,
and that I had already tried for years
to "rehabilitate" her cold ways.
Well, the interesting thing is that,
because I TOTALLY BELIEVED
that this woman was of NO USE
to me, and because I TOTALLY
BELIEVED it was not her fault, I was
TOTALLY CONGRUENT when
I told her "This is over, and I don't
hate you either."
The thing is, this is actually ATTRACTIVE.
Because it implies that she has no worth
to you, and it robs her of her sense of
superior value. How can she have value
if she is worthless to you? Your relative
value to hers becomes superior.
Boom.
Attraction is born.
I didn't realize it at the time, but I had
GROWN internally, my beliefs about
my own value and hers had changed.
My beliefs had become more ATTRACTIVE.
It wasn't a "technique" I learned, it was how
I really felt.
Within DAYS, suddenly YEARS
of supposedly INGRAINED behaviours
in her TOTALLY REVERSED themselves.
To say the least, she started behaving the way
a person who respects another person behaves.
I won't go into the details, but suffice to
say, apparently she COULD "help it" a lot
all those years.
She proved she could be the warmest, most
giving woman on the planet, most dedicated,
most COMMITTED woman to making
it WORK.
In fact, I couldn't find a place to HIDE
from her, she found me wherever I was.
This actually didn't make me happy.
What it did do was prove to me that I had
wasted YEARS of my life ACCEPTING
substandard behaviour and heartache and
indignity because I thought that was
"just the way it is", when in reality a woman
could be TOTALLY capable of being every
bit as perfect as a SAINT.
The only thing that made it NOT a waste
was the super powerful learning experience
that it was for me.
For the next several YEARS, I totally
started doing WHATEVER I wanted
to with women. My new my beliefs
were cemented, and consequently, my
new behaviours were repeated with
tons of different women, with the same
powerful results, ad infinitum.
Most women were great RIGHT OFF THE BAT,
since my frame was solid before they could possibly
have a chance to doubt it.
But even the few who started off
as trying to be "challenging" in return
to me, eventually melted pretty fast,
if I had repeated chances to interact
with them. My frame took over,
because I REALLY believed
in it, it was not some type of act.
This is NOT ego here.
This is just a FACT.
Go and try it in the real world
and you can confirm this.
I picked up women however *I* wanted to,
never giving them ANY privileges, never
for a SECOND thinking any of them were
"special". I made ALL the decisions,
teased them, didn't take them overly
seriously.
I didn't smile like an approval-seeking
geek around women, because I honestly
didn't think they had superior opinions,
I thought of them as primarily being very
smart and feisty when it came to feigning
superiority, mystique, innocence and value,
and in getting men to chase them because
of this.
But I slowly let go of the bitterness as I
realized that this was just the way women
learned to work their way through the world
since time immemorial, and that it was men
who had given the extra power to women
without adjusting to this change themselves.
Instead of thinking of what gift to buy
a woman, I focused on my own goals,
my own things, FIRST, and I also
dumped women at the slightest thing,
which ALWAYS resulted in them only
chasing me HARDER.
I ENTERED the same level of reality that
I thought was exclusively reserved for women,
But the power of that reality had become
MY REALITY.
I learned some pretty crazy stuff too, such
as if you REALLY want to stop a woman
from being with you, the best way is to kiss
UP to her.
I also started to see how most guys really
act around women, and I could SENSE
the vibe that they were creating, because
I could finally see how RIDICULOUS and
REPULSIVE their behaviour was to
a woman who NEEDED a challenge,
who needed something COMPELLING,
something more emotionally powerful,
something more FUN, as opposed to
all these guys who were so serious!
The only thing that all that serious stuff
ends up doing for a guy, if done in the
early stages at least, is making a woman
think the guy is inferior.
The reality is that, if you think about
it, women have in a way given men a
GIFT in terms of the erotic joy that comes
about from actually GETTING a woman
who behaves sexy, hard to get, who is
playful, fun, confident, etc.
It's just gotten a little out of hand these days,
but the reality is that how sexy would it
be if it were the opposite, i.e. if women just
ripped off their clothes for you within minutes
of meeting them, if they acted like typical
desperate GUYS????
The fact of the matter is that women are
damn smart, and throughout history they
trumped the men who thought they could
control women. Men figured they were
in power, but women learned to use sexuality
as the ULTIMATE power. They were
slow to give it away, they knew how to
cloud the secrets to female sexuality in
mystery, making it more appealing and
desirable and adding all kinds of illusions
about it to make it seem more special.
And men FELL for it ALL, they fell for
it GOOD, they fell for it BIG TIME.
And women are not so stupid as to give
all that power away in a world of
"equality". It's more like "yeah,
thanks for making us equals now
but we'll keep the sexual power
superiority thank you very much".
And it's not even CONSCIOUS totally.
It's been INTERNALIZED.
So they are totally CONGRUENT.
The idea of being called a "slut" in public
(it's different in private sometimes!) is
such a negative thing because it strips
away their entire power, i.e. that they
have a "special" sexuality that is only
given to a "rare" guy who "earns" it.
And AGAIN, I repeat, these ideas are
INTERNALIZED to most women, so
they BELIEVE it, so they are
CONGRUENT with it. It's not like
women feel they are using a "technique".
And THIS is what you must pick up
from women, the fact that the beliefs
are INTERNAL. AND you must learn
from women how to present your
entire reality in the most attractive
light, otherwise the reality is that
you are portraying yourself as
INFERIOR, and perception is
reality when it comes to these
things.
Now, for YOU to get to that point where
it ALL feels totally instinctive, I'm not going
to bull*&^% you, you are going to
have to WORK at it for a while.
It takes some effort to debrainwash
yourself, to reset the internal wiring
back to the way it is meant to be.
You're going to have to go out and
APPLY the things I teach you, and at
first it might not be easy. You might
have a fragile ego and it might get hit
emotionally by women, and yet you
are only going to get TOUGHER and
emotionally stronger if you follow
through in the way I suggest, ultimately
leading you to the point where your WORDS
match your FEELINGS.
Your "GAME" will become so tight that in
fact it will not be much of a GAME
at all, it will be INTERNALIZED.
It's WORTH it.
It's the ONLY way.
If you don't put in your dues, and you don't
work on INTERNALIZING your game,
and if you don't work on your ability
to create COOL EMOTIONS in women,
well then YOUR uncool emotions will
ruin your game no matter how cool your
"lines" are or your memorized "tactics".
Incongruity is always evident to people,
even if they are not consciously aware
of it. So the incongruity in a guy who
is SAYING cool things but hasn't paid
his dues developing the internal stuff,
will never fool most women.
You have to get to the point that your
EMOTIONS really ARE feeling the
same stuff ABOUT YOURSELF that
a hot woman feels regarding HER
intrinsic value.
In my life, I keep only the best people
around me, (although it's hard at times
to find the time to just "hang out") we
all make each other's FOUNDATIONS
stronger by pushing each other,
encouraging each other, and reminding
each other to stay on track when we veer
off the right MENTAL FRAME for a
situation.
Now, believe it or not, all this stuff should
be considered part of FOUNDATION LEVEL
understanding. You NEED to have this
understanding to create SOLID and
CONSISTENT attraction with the kind
of women that make your heart pound.
Beyond this level, rests an even DEEPER
level of understanding and skill. This
level is part of what I like to call the
INFINITE BEYOND. It includes an
understanding of the deepest recesses
of a woman's desire and in fact ALL
her emotions. This is the level where
you are able to understand the nuances
and subtleties of a woman's behaviour
in a way that will give you such power
that you genuinely feel EMPATHY
for the woman in front of you, no
matter who she is.
And you will be congruent with it,
because it will come from your
knowledge that you can give her
the GREATEST gift she has ever
experienced- which is EMOTIONAL
fulfillment. When you KNOW you
have something AWESOME to GIVE,
you are bathed in an infinite sense of
calm and security.
This is MORE than just losing any neediness,
it's about also being able to GIVE a woman
what she EMOTIONALLY NEEDS, for REAL.
This will enable you to not only create attraction,
but also a DEEP sense of connection that most
QUALITY women are looking for. Most guys
don't realize how important it is for a woman
to have both, because they don't understand that
SEX is easy for a woman to get. Therefore
ultimate sexual desire in a woman can only
be unleashed when you ALSO know how
to satisfy her other emotions, because they
are ALL connected. One unlocks the door
to the other.
Emotions are the ONLY truth that matters
in this arena.
And you are going to be the biggest GIVER
she ever had, because you are going to be
GIVING her EXACTLY what she NEEDS
to feel INSANELY GREAT.
And believe me, when you can do
THAT to a woman, she won't just
be attracted to you.
She will be OBSESSED with you.
So this is a responsibility that you must
take with great sincerity.
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Gibletpie (originally posted on http://www.fastseduction.com and reposted with permission of the author):
Topic: Hey, wanna fuck my "girlfriend?"
Okay, I've been holding off on posting about my particular and particularly unique situation for some time. In part because I wasn't sure how it would be taken, and in part because I wanted to be certain enough of what was going on to discuss it properly. At any rate, I feel the time is right, it’s my life and this is how I've been living it lately, and I'd frankly like to be able to ask for input from you guys without having to be oblique about the specific situations.
I also really like and respect a lot of guys on this board and I'd like to be a bit less of an enigma.
This is going to be long. Hopefully, it'll be interesting. It’s all necessary. Keep an open mind ; ) I'm running game in a HIGHLY unusual situation… Okay, a year ago, I moved to Brazil. It's always been a dream for me. I've never been a 9 to 5, office-and-desk kind of guy. I've always wanted a bigger life. Travel, adventure, excitement, etc. So when I was offered a job Brazil, I took it.
Now, Brazil is a pretty poor country. Minimum wage down here is about $160 US dollars per month. We make substantially more than that. I really love Brazil and my living here is contingent on working for this agency. We have a great fucking time. Part of what we do is a translation service where we take people around to wherever they want to go and we translate for them, keep them safe, etc. Now, because Brazil is such a poor country, and because they have such REMARKABLY liberal sexual attitudes here, there’s a lot of prostitution. I mean A LOT. Brazil turned down millions of dollars in AIDS grants from the US because they refused to denounce prostitution. The government wants prostitutes to be proud of the job that they do and praise sex workers for sustaining the spirits of men. Quite a different attitude from the US. So, what I discovered after moving here is that a lot of guys (AFCs ), travel to Brazil for specifically for sex. It’s been institutionalized here. There are bars where guys will change into a bathrobe and flip flops, and walk into a bar filled with absolutely stunning Brazilian women. The women wear bikinis. There’s a sauna, and they’re billed as bath houses, hence the bathrobes. I mean, imagine being at the Brazilian version of the Playboy Mansion that’s the fantasy these guys come here for. And 40 minutes to an hour of sex costs them about $100 US a pop. Well, that’s where most guys want to go. They don't know how to get there, they don't speak Portuguese, but that’s what they want to see. So they get a translator/guide. So, essentially, when it’s busy, I can end up being in these places 4 or 5 nights per week, with some guy who wants to fuck three or four 18 to 26 year old Brazilian girls per day. And it’s A LOT of guys. I mean, married guys, guys with girlfriends, guys who just got divorced, WBAFCs who you can tell NEVER get laid without paying, doctors, lawyers, car salesmen, professional athletes (yes, I've shown around guys whose names are VERY recognizable), even Hip Hop stars. Hell, P. Diddy was in Help Disco over Carnival, which is the biggest whorehouse in South America.
I've turned two guys who come down here regularly on to the community, and despite their lays in the US, they still come down here every few months, just because they like fucking 15 hot girls in 5 days with zero effort. One of them calls it "the smorgasbord atmosphere." I've even taken COUPLES who want to swing to these places. The chicks are usually hot. You have to be if you’re going to let your husband fuck other hot women. They say paying for it works best for them. Helps keep things from getting too personal. What do I know, I just translate… (And I've gamed 2 of them for sex closed with the husband’s permission, which felt weird.) So anyway, finding myself in these places most nights with our clients, I thought it would be fun to GAME the girls. I mean, why not? I have to be there, and I'm just hanging out. I may as well have some fun. And the girls are fucking HOT. Some of them look better than TV stars and models in the US.
Now, I got pretty good at running game in the US. I could open easily, get quick attraction, get makeouts and phone numbers, and occasional same night f-closes. I had two girls literally send their boyfriends home so they could hang out with me. One of them, I laid that night.
But I wasn't yet fluent in Portuguese. I'd only studied for two months. So I had to concentrate on other aspects of my game at first. Body language. Non-verbals. Cocky and playful without speaking. Or I'd use what you can find on these boards as "Craig’s Technique." I'd actually used it in the US long before I found out he was using it as well. Open chicks with something simple, a word or gesture, as you’re walking by and re-open later. It’s a great technique. Or, my favorite non-verbal opener: peanuts. Yeah, peanuts. I was sitting across the room from a cute girl. I was bored. There was a bowl of peanuts on my table. So I picked up a peanut and pelted her with it. She glanced down, didn't see anything, went back to talking with her friends. I hit her again. This time, she looked to see where the peanut had come from and she saw me smiling. She went, " Uuugghh !" and did like the hair flip dismissal thing. I picked up another peanut and hit her again. This time she looked straight at me with her ugliest, most withering look. I stared her down, smiling, and laughed at her. I made her look away. Another peanut, and she exploded. "Stop!! You can't do that!!!" I just laughed at her again. It’s important to note that her friends were laughing, too. She was alone on this one. One more peanut, and she just looked down, resigned. She was beaten. I quit. And a half an hour later, she was sitting 3 feet from me, looking at me out of the corner of her eye. So I threw another peanut at her. She almost tried an eye roll , but she was smiling too much. That’s it. She was opened. Small talk and teasing, and she was attracted. See, you can open with fucking anything. All you need to know is what to subcommunicate. Non-neediness, impudence, outcome independence, disregard for her opinion of you, PLAYFULNESS. If you can communicate all of those, it doesn't matter what the fuck you say. You can open with your grocery list.
I got lucky at first. I met a girl who USED to work in one of these places and had quit. A rich Italian sending her money so she didn't have to work. She spoke great English. I banged her for 3 months while he was gone. She was gorgeous. She used to work at a high priced escort agency. She told me she'd been paid by both Snoop Dogg and Lenny Kravitz. She made Salma Hayek look like a 7. I never gave her a fucking dime.
So I had an excuse to be in the bars. I was there as a translator. I wasn't there to fuck. And I was getting laid regularly anyway, so I wasn't trying to close anyone. I'd just run game on all these girls. Run attraction game, but not close. Over months.
My social proof got amazing. I was the fun guy to be with. Girls were always laughing and having a great time. I'd be sitting on the couch and have 2 girls on one side, and 2 on the other, all of them stroking my hair and chest, and they knew I wasn't there to fuck. A new girl would start working there, and see how the girls were with me, and her eyes would blow wide, and within a week, she was sitting right beside me with the rest of them.
The girls started chasing me, giving me their numbers, inviting me to the beach, asking why I didn't call. "I have a girlfriend." The interest got higher. When my girlfriend went back to the rich Italian, I was banging another girl that night. A hot ass little hooker. And I was banging her for free. She was a pain in the ass, and when I dumped her after a week by taking another girl home from the same bar, the two girls started fighting at work. Now, not only was I prequalified, I actually had TWO girls, who are used to men flying in from foreign countries to PAY to fuck them, fighting over who got to bang me for free.
Did my social proof go up? You bet it did. But after I switched out and banged a third girl, they all backed off. They got the impression that I was just going to fuck them for free one time and throw them away. Which also embarrassed them in their SOCIAL CIRCLE, because they all worked at the same place. So I had to switch places and tactics. By this time, a hot little waitress in one of these places was interested in me, knowing that I had gamed and banged some of the working girls "toll-free", as they say in Brazil. She chased me and gave me her number. I f-closed her easily. One more month of, "I have a girlfriend," until the waitress and I parted ways amicably. Girls were always asking, "How’s your girlfriend?" And when I started saying, "We broke up," the answer I usually got was, "Then I'm your new girlfriend." And I'd take her home that night. Here’s where I started running into a different set of problems. All the girls always knew who I was seeing. The girl herself would make sure they all knew because they got a raise in social status from it. So I had to hang onto a girl for more than one night, or they'd all back off into that "well, if he’s just going to fuck me one time, he has to pay me for it." There’s higher social status in being with the alpha male, NOT by being used and thrown away by him quickly. [Incidentally, many of these girls are married or have boyfriends. Some of them know what their wives do, some of them don't . I banged at least 2 girls only to later find out they had husbands… Dangerous shit.]
So my goal in the short term was to keep the girl around long enough that it wouldn't arouse suspicion when I dropped her. See, here’s the thing. NORMAL girls weren't working for me. I'm busy 5 nights a week. What am I going to tell her I'm doing? It doesn't feel Alpha to me to LIE. And the girls know what goes on down here. They can take one look at the group of foreign guys I'm showing around and KNOW that these guys came to Rio for sex. It’s not a hard leap to make. And when I tell them, they simply DO NOT believe that I'm going in there and not having sex. So they get jealous and freak and drop out. One girl lasted about a month until she told me, "If I found out you were fucking girls in those places, I would hate you. And I couldn't take that. So I can't see you anymore." We’re still friends. So, I felt like I was sort of stuck with the gorgeous hookers. LOL . They’re beautiful girls, they’re sweethearts, really, when you get to know them, and the sex is FANTASTIC. If you haven't been to Rio, the girls down here are really extremely feminine and very HD . So my "girlfriend" would get up in the morning, fuck me, go to work, fuck other guys, come home and fuck me. I learned quickly that being jealous in any sort of way would cause me all sorts of grief. The easiest way to keep them happy was to PUSH them to fuck other guys, which would make them cling harder to me. JUST LIKE ASF DOCTRINE. See here’s the girls’ frame. "This is just my JOB. It’s different. I have to work." So if you fuck someone else it’s "cheating," but if she fucks someone else at work, it’s "just work. Not my heart." A few notes here. Most of them really can't help but hook. They have to support mothers or children or whatever the fuck and there’s really no way for them to make enough money in Brazil in other ways. I'm not saying my heart is bleeding, that’s just the way it is. And I'm not paying her fucking bills. If you need to hook, keep hookin’ . Also, I want to say that these places are always very safe. As safe as you can get anyway. The girls have blood tests every two weeks, and have a doctor on premises to check them personally twice per week, and if a girl catches something, she can't work, so they always use condoms.
After 1 year, I haven't caught absolutely anything.
So, anyway, lately my M .O. has been to pick a hot one, bang her for about a month, "break up" over something, then pick another. It’s easy fucking pickings, man. A new girl starts and I'll chat her up, and my "ex" will get jealous and say, "That’s my ex boyfriend," and then the girl will get really interested, then all these other girls will come up to kiss me hello, and they'll shoot the girl dirty looks, and after that, my work is almost done. Just be congruent with that value and establish a little comfort. I'm proofed as fuck. I set out to see if I could game the girls and I succeeded far better than I imagined.
Fuck, these days, one of these places does a shower show on Friday nights with 3 or 4 girls eating each other out in the shower. When I'm there, the manager (a gay guy, LOL), will call me over to emcee the show over the microphone IN PORTUGUESE (I've gotten much better). Some guy tried to start a fight with me one night and I dumped him on his ass, sat on him and started beating him. Security pulled me off him, threw the Brazilian out, and told me, "Don't worry. Everybody here knows you. You're fine." How much more proofed could I be?!?! Now here’s the thing. I mean, from an intellectual standpoint. How to avoid the exclusivity frame? I mean, it sounds fucking stupid in this context, but Brazilian girls are extremely jealous. You get them attracted and they REALLY want to hang on. And these girls have this frame like, "If I'm fucking you for free, you’re not fucking anyone else!" The last one was a real pain in the ass. She'd call me at Noon and Midnight every day when she wasn't with me, "Where are you? Who are you with? Are you cheating on me?" After a month, I dumped her. These girls get really bent out of shape when you dump them, too. I mean, a hot fucking 19 year old HB9 or 10 who’s used to getting chased and paid for sex, and then she’s fucking you for free and YOU dump HER? I don't think most of these girls have ever really been dumped in their lives. After I split with her, another girl was like, "Then I'm your new girlfriend." I just smiled. She had been chasing me for months. Later that night when she saw me talking with another girl, she said, "Are you cheating on me?" I just smiled and said, "Oh, do you have a piece of paper saying I can only stay with you?" [I know I could have used something better here what would work best here, a polyamory talk? Just go straight at it, given the context?] She said she was flustered. She said, " I'll make this piece of paper. I will." Then after some thought, she said, "I like you enough that I'll let you stay with another girl." And I said, "That’s why I adore you." And kissed her on the cheek. She was just sitting there shaking her head. She couldn't believe it. But I think I blew her out. She hasn't really spoken to me since.
Very high social proof makes it easy to get the first lay, but it makes it extremely hard to keep the girl going. They stay really fucking jealous about all the other girls around me. Which is their problem, but sooner or later, it becomes my problem. (Aside from that, it’s the same fucking game. Two nights ago, I had a girl sitting with me who’s been interested for about a month. I asked her, "Do you like Mexican food?" She said, " I've never had it!" interested. I said, " I'm eating Mexican with my friends later. But you can't go. You have to work." I stated it flatly, without a hint of an invite. She stuck her lip out, pouty. I said, "You have to work. No?" She nodded, "Yes," still acting sad. I said, "Well, maybe we could go some weekend." She’s like, " I'll give you my number." I said, "Okay." And let it go. 10 minutes later, I pull my phone out to check the time. She holds out her hand. I close the phone and put it back in my pocket. She says, "Take my number!" Perfect push-pull. Social proof, DHV, push-pull, qualify, comfort, escalate. Same fucking game.)
And more importantly (lest you all think I'm fucking nuts), HOW to date NORMAL GIRLS? I mean, I get plenty of pussy, I'm not going to complain, but I really miss normal girls and having someone around that I don't already know I'm going to dump in a few weeks. I can't switch jobs, and this is sort of an aspect of my job. So how can I set the frame with a NORMAL girl so that the fact that I have to spend time in these places is not going to blow her out? I've gotten over all my jealousy issues in the last year, believe me, but it IS nice to have a girl and not KNOW that 3 or 4 other guys have been up in her TODAY. LOL. Okay, thanks for getting this far. Hope it’s been interesting.
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PROMOS & REVIEWS SECTION (there are NO paid ads in this list and never have been. The "commercial" section is distinguished by the "--------------" separators):
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LAIR SECTION (Lairs are gatherings of PUA's of differing levels and talents that meet in different cities to discuss their experiences and to work together to improve their success with women). More Lair Listings can be found at http://dutchseduction.blogspot.com/ and at http://www.bristollair.com, as well as at http://www.seductionlair.com:
A YAHOO GROUP FOR THOSE RUNNING LAIRS:
If and ONLY if you are running a lair there is now a Yahoo Group for organization ideas for PUA groups. As each lair is different, this group lets us know what other lairs are doing. No seduction related topics are discussed, just organization ideas. To join please email RunningaPUAgroup-subscribe@yahoogroups.com and then email Nightlife at nightlife858@yahoo.com with an intro of who you are and what Lair you are running. You can also go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RunningaPUAgroup/
LAIR GROUP
If you run a lair or are considering starting one, join this group to exchange ideas with the rest of the community and keep informed of community activities. http://www.LairList.com Contact: LairList@LairList.com
Lair List is an official directory of lairs worldwide. The Lair List Foundation is an international nonprofit cooperation of lair owners. LairList.com is completely nonprofit. LairList.com is 100% non-commercial. If you run a lair or are considering starting one, register your lair here http://lairlist.com/index.php?option=com_comprofiler&task=registers. Join this group (http://lounge.lairlist.com/) to exchange ideas with the international lair community. Get the latest seduction news from around the world (http://www.lairlist.com/).
HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE MONTREAL LAIR:
- Lair meetings are scheduled for Sundays at 8 pm and the next Lair meeting hasn't been scheduled yet. For more info on joining the Lair (local only, sorry), email me. Out of town bros are welcome to drop in to meetings.
The Lair meetings are very insightful gatherings of guys interested in learning, improving, and helping others to become more successful in their relationships with women. If you are already in a relationship, and you continue to read these emails, you should realize that there is information here to improve and enhance your existing relationship - not only to create new ones.
Here is a list of other Lairs around the world (if you know of any others, please let me know):
MONTREAL JUNIOR LAIR FOUNDED!
Montreal Junior Lair: The Montreal X-Lair has been founded to help minors (who are not permitted to join the Montreal Lair until they are 18) get together and communicate. Lair applications would be sent to MontrealXLair@hotmail.com.
THE TORONTO LAIR
The Toronto Lair is called TSN or Toronto Social.net. Anyone who gets to the homepage at http://www.TorontoSocial.net./ can email the webmaster to get information. If that's not an option, they can call Ike at: 416-628-9973 or his cell at: 416-300-6500.
Vancouver Social Board
A tight and good group of guys from various backgrounds who want to learn how to become better with women. We have two rules 1) this is not a competition, we are here to help each other and 2) you must be willing to try. We go out very regularly and have some skilled guys.
Visit Yahoo Group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vancouversocialboard/ Contact: Docandwriter (docandwriter@shaw.ca)
Victoria Social society
This is an open group for all you Victorian men (Victoria, British Columbia, Canada)who wish the study and pursue the art of seduction.
Visit Yahoo Group:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/victoriasocialsociety/
Contact: Docandwriter (docandwriter@shaw.ca)
Calgary Social Group
This is the Calgary PUA Lair for men (young and old) who want to get together to discuss PU and go sarging in Calgary. This group is meant to enrich the lives of men and, I believe ,women indirectly. Everyone can learn and it's only the lack of support and positive influence that cause people to stop trying. Here we can all grow as men and learn the skills we need to accomplish our goals.
Visit Yahoo Group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/calgarysocialgroup/
Contact: Elantraman (elantraman2002@yahoo.com) or Docandwriter (docandwriter@shaw.ca)
NEW LAIR FORMING IN MILWAUKEE: I am going to be starting a new lair consisting of only the Milwaukee and surrounding areas naturals. I feel like with this caliber of a Lair only success is an option. This is going to be a bunch of guys meeting up sporatically for sarging and for schedualed meetings. If you feel you qualify and can positively impact our group, email me at allimalgam@aol.com.
AUSTRIAN PLAYERS
Home of the legendary EuroSummit 2005, most diverse members from total beginners to serial layers from Austria, Germany and Switzerland. Join us! (If you happen to ravel by, drop us a line!) Visit: http://www.austrianplayers.com Contact: Neodes@austrianplayers.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN AMSTERDAM/HOLLAND:
The lair can be found at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Amsterdam_Dating/
NEW LAIR FORMING IN PORTLAND, MAINE
I'm starting a lair in Portland, Maine so we can truly be "the way life should be"!
Starting with a dozen AFCs & PUAs and looking to grow and share our skills.
Send email to magickman@maine.rr.com if you wish to join.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN MISSISSIPPI/ALABAMA
I'm starting up a lair in MS/AL for anyone in driving distance to the Birmingham area. Contact blake1_19@yahoo.com for anyone interested in joining.
SALT LAKE CITY AND SURROUNDING AREAS
AFCs to PUAs. Meet and share seduction tips. We meet once a week and help push members to become the man they desire!
Contact UtahX at utahrafc@gmail.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN NORFOLK-VIRGINIA BEACH, VIRGINIA
I'm interested in starting a Seduction Lair in the Norfolk-Virginia Beach area. If anyone is interested, please email me. Thanks,
Stingray9001 stingray9001@yahoo.com
NEW LAIR FORMED IN DENVER
Denver Lair is a community for Denver/Boulder/Colorado area PUAs to wing, talk about the game and make friends in the community. If you're in the Colorado, join our yahoo-group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/denver_puas/
NEW LAIR FORMING IN RICHMOND, VIRGINIA
Hi, I'm starting a lair in Richmond, Virginia, the state capitol with a rather big scene. Currently all gamers in Richmond are forced to go up to DC, or down to North Carolina if they wish to attend a lair meeting. I would like to keep that experience at home, as we have many beautiful women in this wonderful city. Send an email to miikey723@yahoo.com if you wish to join.
EUROPE LAIR FOUNDED
Red Priest has founded the Europe Lair. You can find the description here:
http//groups.yahoo.com/group/europelair/
ISRAEL LAIR:
For the Israel Lair, Tironut 69, go to http://www.tironut69.com
DUNEDIN, NEW ZEALAND LAIR FORMING
For all you Otago students (or campus orbiters) who think you got game! This will be the southernmost lair in the world. Run by an RAFC with a fair bit of bookwork and small experience- any skill level you want, just prepared to approach, talk and try out new stuff. Email me at beest.goes.roar@gmail.com, and will see if we can't get a local lair started. it's time to bring the game to the deep south!
WELLINGTON, NEW ZEALAND LAIR:
An active lair is up and running in Wellington, NZ. Primary focus is going out and working in the field. All skill levels are welcome. Anybody who wants to join constructive, like-minded people in persuing the PUA lifestyle. We have a forum, and a bunch of friendly people who can wing with you to get you off of the ground; email Matt via moxyfmac@gmail.com
TAMPA BAY AND ST. PETE, FLORIDA:
We started a new Lair in the Tampa Bay area. All styles welcome. e-mail us at paradigmaman@yahoo.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN GENEVA
We want to create a Lair in Geneva, Switzerland. It would be open to French and English speaking people living in Geneva and neighbouring cities like Lausanne and France as well willing to meet and seduce women. All skill levels and ages are accepted. The main task of the Lair will be field experiences on a regular basis. Contact Julien at : Julien72@bluewin.ch
NEW GROUP FOR CHICAGO
Chicago Wingman Meetup Group which currently holds meetings on the first Saturday of every month at 3:00 pm, the place will be disclosed to members once they sign up for the group. The website address is http://wingman.meetup.com/18/ - this group is combining with the Chicago Lair, whose contact was Eric at theprogen2003@yahoo.com Since they've just starting to hold meetings, they have a flexible format but as they get more organized they plan to have guest speakers. Anyone who knows a local PUA (not self proclaimed) is encouraged to invite him/ her over to share ideas. Please post all org issues under http://www.fastseduction.com/cities/Chicago
NEW LAIR FOR EDMONTON
*The Mastermind* The Mastermind is a highly exclusive Pick Up Artist Lair. Based out of Edmonton, Canada we assist guys who are serious and motivated to improve their Pick Up Artist game. We’re located at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/edpualair/ You can also email: manofadventure@jasons-world.com
SAN RAFAEL, CALIFORNIA
The Seduction Lair is up and running in San Rafael, California. Contact activte@aol.com for more information.
PARIS PICK UP CLUB
Formed by a group of FRIENDLY motivated guys from all nationalities with some solid game. The Paris Pick Up Club (PPC) is where all the PUA's and RAFC's BROTHERS living in Paris can share experiences, wing with different people and practice techniques. The goal is to IMPROVE our GAME while having lots of FUN. Since the purpose of the PPC is to practice, in order to join, future members must be available to SARGE regularly. Contact alfaztec@yahoo.com
BELGIUM: NL Lounge at dutchseduction.com
An independent platform for the phenomenon known as "seduction" in the Dutch language with members in Amsterdam, the Netherlands, Belgium and points beyond. Founded in 1999, we are one of the first international groups dedicated to seduction. Our purpose is to help members meet one another and share information and experience. Write to passie at passie@gmail.com Visit our Website: http://www.DutchSeduction.com
NETHERLANDS: NL Lounge at dutchseduction.com An independent platform for the phenomenon known as "seduction" in the Dutch language with members in Amsterdam, the Netherlands, Belgium and points beyond. Founded in 1999, we are one of the first international groups dedicated to seduction. Our purpose is to help members meet one another and share information and experience. Write to passie at passie@gmail.com Visit our Website: http://www.DutchSeduction.com
NEW LAIR IN NEW ORLEANS
There is a new Lair in New Orleans and here is the info:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NewOrleansPlayers/ - MIKEALW@HOTMAIL.COM.
Description: This group is for guys in the New Orleans area who are studying the Double your Dating material by David DeAngelo. This group is to get and give advice, to share your experiences and results, and to hook up with other guys so you can go out and work on your game together. Anyone in the New Orleans area is welcome from inexperienced to PUA's.
NEW LAIR IN SINGAPORE
The Singapore Lair is a community for guys interested in improving their skills in meeting and attracting/seducing women. This group is mainly for guys who live in or travel to Singapore, although PUAs from other countries are also welcome. Membership is restricted to doers only -- you must be in the field and have real field experience. No armchair theorists allowed. To join this group, email singaporelair-owner@yahoogroups.com with your name, background and experience.
DALLAS LAIR
The Dallas Seduction Lair has been around for over a year now. We have had 18 official events of both discussion and seminar style events. As well as countless nights of sarging with newfound wingmen by our members. We are now over 120 members strong. Anyone at any skill level with a desire to learn is welcome. More information at: http://wingman.meetup.com/6/ or http://www.DallasSeductionLair.com
DALLAS PUA
DallasPua.com is formed from the spirit of helping my fellow brothers become better in their sarging skills of women and of life; to develop their individual integrity. The site offers many free features such as a forum ( http://www.dallaspua.com/forum ), personal journals/blogs, extensive resource page, and more. It is based out of Dallas, but the tailored PUA features are available to anyone. This is your site! For more info go to http://www.DallasPua.com
HUNGARIAN LAIR FORMING
Hungarian Lair (Budapest) invites all visiting and local people for a great time of sarging in Budapest clubs and streets. We field test MM, SS, RSD, Maniac Plan and various other stuff. Contact us at redpriest_hu@yahoo.com!"
NEW LAIR FORMING IN ITALY:
Our goal is to have a lot of FUN! Why did we create a Lair? To keep in touch with each other and to rock the Italian scene, we want to live like rockstars since we know we DESERVE IT. We have had enough of all the boring guys and loser boyfriends out there that are making women's lives a nightmare when they are waiting for US, the playboys. Join us and we will share with you a lot of secrets that you need to know to totally transform your life life and get more choice not only in life but with every relationship. In order to learn you must be willing to go out with us and try new stuff asking to yourself: "What is possible? What if I get the results I only dreamed of and then even more than that?" Send an email at italy_lair@yahoo.com to join.
NEW LAIR FORMED IN NORWICH (UK):
The Norwich Lair is a group for pickup artists in Norwich (UK) and the surrounding areas. The lair meets every Saturday night , 10PM in Norwich
City. The group is not a talking shop, if you want to remain in the lair you must participate in fieldwork every 90 days. To join the group, send an email to thenorwichlair-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
OHIO LAIR FORMED:
An Ohio Lair has just been created for ASFers located in Ohio. I'm hoping to have regular sarging meetings at different cities in Ohio and regular guest speakers. Any ASFer in Ohio who is interested in joining please email me an intro of yourself to philonous03@yahoo.com.
VIRGINIA/CAROLINA LAIR GROUP
The VAC (Virginia Carolina) Lair is a community for Virginia and Carolina area PUAs to talk about the game, make friends in the community, and meet up with wings in the area. Current members are located in the Charlotte, Blacksburg/Radford, and Raleigh/Chapel Hill areas. While those from outside this area are encouraged to participate, most events will likely be held within these areas. The VAC Lair is open to all levels from Beginner to PickUp Artist (PUA). Just come with a desire to learn, a willingness to share what you know, and a commitment to field test what you learn. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vaclair/
NEW YORK CITY LAIR:
New York City Team Strike Force - The oldest lair in the U.S. and the only one that can lay claim to having dedicated instructors of reputation on staff, just for the members. Very organized, very respected and very strong sense of community, as well as life balance. You know you want us. Visit @ http://www.nyclair.com Please email admin@nyclair.com to request information about membership.
SECOND NEW YORK LAIR STARTED:
With the help of a few friends, Strongbad has started a lair in NYC. Send an email to either strongbadpua@yahoo.com or
NY-PLAY-subscribe@yahoogroups.com to join if you live in the NY area.
BLOOMINGTON LAIR STARTED:
The Bloomington, IN lair for guys interested in attraction/seduction. This is a group made for guys that want to discuss techniques, inner game, make
new friends, and meet up with wings in the Bloomington area. If your interested in subscribing email: b-lair-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
AUCKLAND, NEW ZEALAND LAIR
Anyone living in Auckland (New Zealand) are welcome to join this bad ass lair. It's consantly growing, we have guys with all sorts of experience levels with diverse styles of game. We SARGE regularly. So if you're up for some fun e-mail us at akpuah@gmail.com"
SCOTLAND LAIR:
There is now a Scotland Lair. It's the SSs Group and we have a website at http://www.scotlandlair.com that we JUST put up. The group is currently yahoo based and we would like to start taking in any members who may or may not have heard about us yet. To join, they can visit SSs.scotlandlair.com which will redirect them to our mailing list, or email signup@scotlandlair.com for more instructions on joining. The website is starting to grow big as it's seen on ASF. We have our own discussion forums. We also have a photo and VIDEO gallery where PUAs can upload their own photos and videos and browse those of others!! We are also giving out free scotlandlair.com email addresses to contributors.
BRAZIL NOW HAS A LAIR:
To join please send an email to Brazil_P-L-A-Y-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN TOKYO:
The Tokyo lair now has a discussion board for discussing the finer points of the Japanese scene, guys looking to meet wings and discuss all things nanpa can email tokyolair@hotmail.com for an invite to the board.
NEW LAIR FORMED IN ARIZONA:
We have formed a lair for guys interested in pickup and seduction in Arizona. It is open to anyone in the state, regardless of specific city, or skill level. If you are interested in joining, send an email to cramias@mail.com and you will receive an invite to our private forums.
ANNOUNCING SOUTH FLORIDA P-L-A-Y LIST:
The South Florida P-L-A-Y list is a community for Miami, Ft Lauderdale and Boca-Palm Beach area PUA's to meet up and improve their game in the field.
All methods are welcome. Please understand that our primary focus will be field work. To join, please contact Zuzu atSouthFlorida-P-L-A-Y-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
THE INDIA LAIR
We are a small but dynamic bunch of aspiring PUAs in India. Guys of all skill levels are welcome but MUST be serious about actually getting out in the field. Please register at the site. New registrants will be verified to weed out KJs. Visit http://www.indialair.com
BRISTOL LAIR
These guys have a truly great site, with a lot of terrific resources. Go to http://www.bristollair.com.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN DALLAS/FORT WORTH:
If you are interested in joining, please send an e-mail to dfwseductionlair@yahoo.com.
NEW LAIR IN GERMANY!
The name of the group is PU_Meetings_Germany. It´s a field oriented group and we welcome everybody from all over Germany to join and attend our meetings which are held in different cities all over Germany. For further information write to: pimpstylez@hotmail.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN ORANGE COUNTY, CALIFORNIA:
A new lair called the O.C. Player's Group is forming for members of the seduction community in Orange County, California. The group will be a place for everyone from aspiring to accomplished PUAs in "the OC" to post their pick up experiences and successes and meet occasionally in a constructive and non-critical environment. Everyone is welcome, but you must be serious about becoming a PUA and the emphasis will be on getting out into the field and reporting on what worked and what didn't. Armchair pua/theorists need not apply! Contact pua1day (Kurt) for further information at o.c.playasgroup@sbcglobal.net or to join at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ocplayasgroup/
NEW LAIR FORMING IN HARRISBURG, PA:
No keyboard Junkies, only people who are willing to go out in the field and just get better at the game. All levels are welcome. Contact Gaurang at
NEW SYDNEY LAIR STARTED!!!
Monthly meetings with guest speakers. All levels welcomed only prerequisite is that you are in the field. To join please email ta_justin@hotmail.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN OKLAHOMA CITY:
Lu is looking to start a lair in Oklahoma City, OK. He would like to invite anyone who's interested in going out sarging to join, & help him get the lair started, please respond only if you are interested in Going Out & SARGE, or Doing Field Work, contact him at ljp97001@yahoo.com.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN PHILADELPHIA
Looking for a group of guys interested in a Lair in the Philly area. All experience levels welcome but must be willing to actually go into the field. See philadelphiaLair@yahoogroups.com or email me at myaroch@yahoo.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN AUCKLAND, NEW ZEALAND:
We have already met-up with couple of local guys and SARGE 2-3 times a week. We are willing to meet-up with more guys to share the PU knowledge and experience to improve our game. Those of you who are interested contact us at sexualpredator@em-wave.com"
KANSAS CITY LAIR FORMING:
Looking to get a group of like minded guys together to share ideas and most importantly work the field in Kansas City MO. Write eclypz@hotmail.com and include "From Cliff's List" in the title.
NEW LAIR FORMED IN CONNECTICUT:
Open to PUAs and RAFCs who live in CT who are interested in or have real field experience as opposed to keyboard theory. Send an email to djsemtp00@aol.com with your background and experience.
NEW LAIR FORMED IN OTTAWA:
Ottawa Lair yahoo group created http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ottawalair/
NEW LAIR FORMED IN BOSTON:
The Boston Lair is now open. The lair is a forum for brothers in the Boston, Rhode Island, and upper New England area to get together and meet others in the game and to build an active community in Boston and the surrounding areas. To subscribe to the Lair, email b-o-s-lair-subscribe@yahoogroups.com.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN NORTH CAROLINA:
A group is interested in forming a lair in the North Carolina area. Members include attendees of the Charlotte Sargeathon in November 2003. Meetings may rotate through different cities (possibly outside North Carolina) depending on interest. Contact Jason at thee_jacas@yahoo.com with LAIR in the subject line for more information.
NEW LAIR FORMED IN POLAND:
We've formed a LAIR in Poland http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pflayers/join so if anybody is interested in joining it contact me at PFLayers-owner@yahoogroups.com or subscribe at PFLayers-subscribe@yahoogroups.com. It's unmoderated formum where You can excange your views on the game and meet with wings in your area.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN LAS VEGAS:
Nightlife who runs San Diego is helping a few guys set something up in Vegas so a new group is now forming. To join please send an email LV-P-L-A-Y-subscribe@yahoogroups.com be prepared to give a brief intro.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN ITALY:
Milano will be headquarters. All Italians, Swiss, Austrians, etc are welcome to join. Would like to set up infrastructure for weekly or biweekly weekend sargefests, both day and night. Goals include: hosting seminars/workshops of the world's best PUAs, sharing the best techniques for Italian hotbabes, sarging together, sarging trips to Roma, Firenze, etc. We need to get a solid core of about 10 guys to really get it going. All levels welcome. Email italypua@yahoo.com for info.
ATLANTA LAIR:
Contact: groovewhiz@yahoo.com
NEW LAIR FORMING MILWAUKEE TO MADISON:
A Lair is start for the Milwaukee to Madison, Wisconsin area. Emphasis will be on field sarging and developing a network of like-minded "wings" to develop and maintain a secret society in this area. We will SARGE from the college bars of Madison to the redneck fishermen bars of Lake Country to the cheesy working class discos of Milwaukee. All interested parties (male or female) please contact g66@outgun.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN MONTERREY, MEXICO:
The style I use is C&F from DYD, but am willing to try other styles, and will be very focused in going out and learning. Anyone interested in forming a Lair here in Mexico just write to me: javimartinez50@hotmail.com
NEW LAIR FORMING IN HONOLULU, HAWAII:
Showing those surfergirls a good time since late '03. Drop an e-mail to lair808@hotmail.com for more info on building sandcastles.
NEW LAIR IN CHINA (MAINLAND, TAIWAN, HK):
A list for China based PUA has been set-up. Discuss PU tactics/experiences in China, and meet and practice with other local PUA. Contact Angel Caido on el_angel_caido@lycos.com and join the group @ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PUA-china/join
NEW LAIR FORMING IN OSLO:
The Oslo Lair just opened. If you are interested / want to join, go to http://groups.yahoo.com/group/asf-Oslo/ and apply. We will start out with monthly meetings, on the first Sunday of every month. The first meeting will be held December 7th, at 18h00.
NEW LAIR FORMING IN LOS ANGELES:
The LA List, PLAY (Player's Los Angeles Yahoo) Group, is a community for Los Angeles area PUAs to talk about the game, make friends in the community, and meet up with wings in the LA area. The PLAY List is a community that is open to the public and is a place where you can share your views on any methods in an unmoderated (except for deletion of spam) forum. Contact Papa at papa@realsocialdynamics.com and get on the mailing list by emailing p-l-a-y-subscribe@yahoogroups.com.
WASHINGTON, D.C.:
DC Seduction, formerly known as DC Area PUAs, has been around since 2000. We are over three dozen brothers drawn from the FastSeduction, SS, and the Lounge communities. Contact Minger at minger@dcseduction.com
SEATTLE LAIR FORMING!
I would like to find out how many are interested in forming a Seattle Lair. Contact theloinking1@hotmail.com to get on their mailing list.
THE AUSTIN SOCIETY (AUSTIN, TEXAS)
The Austin Society is a group of friends, within the greater Austin/San Antonio area, improving their attraction and relationship skills through field work and study. If you are interested in joining and contributing to our group, email us at theaustinsociety@yahoogroups.com for more info. Open-minded gentlemen of all skill levels are welcome."
NEW ORLEANS LAIR FORMING:
Joseph is looking to set up or find a "mastermind group" of likeminded people and he is in the south MS area about 1.5 hours drive from New Orleans or the MS gulf coast. He would like to invite anyone in MS/LA/AL within driving distance to participate, and to help him to get it started. Contact him at: veuxdeux@yahoo.com
NYC:
Contact Marco, marcorulesinfinity@yahoo.com and get on their mailing list: NYCTSF-SUBSCRIBE@YAHOOGROUPS.COM
SAN DIEGO (TWO GROUPS NOW!):
1) The San Diego lair is now opening their doors to potential new members for the next 30 days. If interested in joining the San Diego lair please contact Nightlife at nightlife@playboylifestyle.net
2) Pete M., and Nightlife have formed another seduction group in San Diego. This is to benefit guys who are interested in Pick Up who live or frequent San Diego. It is a group that is modeled after the LA P-L-A-Y list. To join send an email to SD-P-L-A-Y-subscribe@yahoogroups.com It is open to everyone in San Diego.
SAN FRANCISCO BAY AREA LAIR:
We have a very active group in the San Francisco area dedicated to improving their game. All skill levels and types of game welcome. We have meetings once every 6 weeks or so, and numerous SARGE outings. We also have top PUA's share their knowledge with us when they come to San Francisco. Our list traffic is low but valuable. Lots of field reports and feedback. To join send an email to sf_morpheus_x@yahoo.com, and mention you heard about us on Cliff's list.
DETROIT LAIR:
New lair starting in Detroit area. Guys of all skill levels are welcome but MUST be SERIOUS about learning. The group will be interactive and do field work also.
Any one willing to learn or teach is welcome. Send Greg an email saying your interested at Grgreg_2001@yahoo.com
HOUSTON:
http://www.houstonlair.com Members of the Lair meet regularly, actively apply and improve their skills and are eager to teach success. Contact: xmlenigma, bashev can be reached at xmlenigma@yahoo.com, rnkayab@hotmail.com
MELBOURNE, AUSTRALIA:
Turning KJs into Active PUA
Members meet twice weekly with approximately 200+ registered members. Currently run mini study groups on Mystery Method, Gunwitch Method, Juggler, SS. We usually meet out in the field and streets so there is plenty of field practice. Our Sarge-Fest is a great learning night for newbies where some of Australias best PUA coach you to improve your game. We also organize other activities such as Salsa dance nights for our members and we encourage our members to contribute back to the community to help it grow. The lair currently runs its own forum so come join this active lair.
Contact iceman at melb.lair.autoreply@gmail.com. See http://Melb-Lair.com
AUCKLAND, NEW ZEALAND
Philip has started a LAIR for those who live in the upper North Island of New Zealand (Auckland, Hamilton, Tauranga, etc). There are already 4 of them who have been meeting regularly in Auckland, and they welcome others to be in touch. SSer's from elsewhere in New Zealand are also welcome to email to share experiences and form a network. Contact: philip@toeb.co.nz
MIAMI:
Contact Jerry at trudelle@email.com to attend.
LONDON, ENGLAND
The London Seduction Society http://www.thelss.com
AMSTERDAM:
Contact Big Bear http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nllounge/
The main purpose of the Lair is to help Wingmen to get in touch with each other and "in field" action! Membership open to anyone who lives in Holland or Belgium, or is a frequent visitor. However membership policy is strict.
PERTH, AUSTRALIA:
The Perth lair is a small group of people who SARGE regularly several times a week. At the moment, I'm actively looking for new members to join us on our outings (the more the merrier!). Anyone wishing to go sarging with us any day of the week should email me at tnejad@hotmail.com to meet up.
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Blake Richards has put out a new ebook that looks very interesting. Check it out here: http://www.social-mastery.com/Game.html
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Real Social Dynamics WORKSHOPS:
I highly recommend that you check these guys out. They are in the final stages of producing their long-awaited e-book as well as a redesign of their website.
Anyone interested in attending their seminars and/or workshops, email Papa at papa@realsocialdynamics.com with the subject "WORKSHOP" and mention that you heard about it from Cliff's List.
Real Social Dynamics (http://www.realsocialdynamics.com/ ):
Learn what works in seminar, and then jump directly into the field and watch the instructors demonstrate and teach it live. Stop feeling the fear of not knowing what to do ...
Individualized Bootcamps
Sign up and get more info here: http://www.realsocialdynamics.com/) Real Social Dynamics has just launched its new website, forum communities, and Foundations DVD/CD set. This is the most comprehensive program they 've delivered at a seminar and they were fortunate to have recorded it as well. Visitors can check out the new forum or get the new Foundations home study course at http://www.realsocialdynamics.com/
More info also available by sending an email to: support@relsocialdynamics.com
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The Venusian Art Society is dedicated to the pursuit of Relationship Mastery.
We have started a Yahoo group in each city our members are located in Denver,Houston, and Atlanta. You can register for membership by going to Yahoo and joining V_A_S_D or V_A_S_A or V_A_S_H. Be sure to include your experience in the Venusian Arts as well as what you hope to get out of them.
This forum will serve as a way to discuss any and all issues related to the Venusian Arts, from cold approach to relationship management. We welcome all active participants in the Venusian arts from any of the various schools such as MM, SS, DYD, etc..
This will be a controlled forum so feel free to post anything you want as long as it is directly relatable to the Venusian Arts. This is not a classified board or a place to advertise.
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New Dating/Seduction Seminars & Workshop in Montreal by DOC!
Doc, who many of you know from his great interview here last time and all too rare but outstanding posts on this list, on Mystery's Lounge, and the Montreal Lair, is bringing his seminars and speed dating events to Montreal. Previously they were mainly held in Toronto as part of the Learning Annex, Doc is now setting it up here and plans to hold events on a monthly basis.
The website is http://www.lifeskillsnetwork.ca. Registrations available on the website. The events are Dating Secrets for Women, a 3 Hour seminar (cost $50) and Dating Secrets for Guys; a Guide to The Art of Dating (also 3 hours and $50). There will also be a speed dating event in the evening for $50. You can contact Doc by email at seduction.school@sympatico.ca.
The fall calendar has a full weekend seminar and makeover. He also has 3 new books coming out this fall under the SETNA Dating Manual Series. Volume I (to be released this week) deals with the psychology of attraction, first impressions, and working on your inner game, Volume II (coming in September) deals with tactics and strategies to go from meeting her to dating her, and Volume III will deal with Managing Relationships.
Full-weekend Dating Makeover workshops will be offered soon (including a half day with a personal stylist, video tape analysis of body language, and live practice sessions with dating coaches beautiful women who will give the guys on the spot feedback on how they come across and what to improve). If there is a group of 10 or more guys interested in a seminar (or 5 guys for a workshop, he would consider making a special trip to their city).
This is a great opportunity to learn from a real master.
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Mystery Method Workshops:
What method are YOU using?
If you are opening groups (or sets: 2-sets, 3-sets, mixed sets, etc) of people with the 3 second rule by stacking indirect openers (including false opinion openers), false time constraining (discovered by Style), demonstrating a higher value to your romantic interest’s peer group with high octane DHVs while she obliquely observes (locking her into her own set with a prop), and simultaneously performing false disqualifiers (which include negs) on her with the intension of disarming her peergroup and then isolating her to rebuild her self-esteem once you have enough IOIs (indicators of interest) so you may share in a comfort and trust building effort and then build in a jealousy subplot to solidify her attraction for you, you are using The Mystery Method.
If instead you are only approaching women who are alone, you are greatly limiting your options and quite likely alienating your target's friends. Do you want a lonely woman (why is she lonely?) or a woman who already has a healthy social lfe? Truth is, healthy women have healthy relationships ... sometimes good friendships with guys. Like it or not, you will have to meet these women with men in her group.
Women of beauty are rarely found alone. Don't miss the opportunity to meet and attract them WITH social proof from her very own peergroup. Group Approach Theory (GAT - created by me) improves your options and increases the chances for attraction DRAMATICALLY over Single Approach Theory (SAT).
The guys who are GREAT in this game KNOW that they can improve their game ten-fold through seminars and personal coaching in-field workshops. Think about this: Why did so many of the greats who use my GAT (Style, Tyler D., MTL_PUA, and others) take my seminars and workshops? What started them off to greatness in this game? Can you see the co-relation may in fact be a causation?
If you have NEVER taken a seminar or workshop before, it's time to finally reconsider. They are life-transforming. I have conducted dozens of them. I am currently conducting a bootcamp and will accept only 5 people. Workshops and seminars were for many of the greats THE difference between great success and failure. If you are ready, give me a call and sign up. If you have any questions, give me a shout at 323-219-8696 (Mystery) because email sucks, or visit http://www.Mysterymethod.com and email me your #. We need to talk. Man to man.
NEW: Attraction Magic
Content: In the Attraction Magic Seminar, Mystery will teach you the magical illusions most useful in picking up women. In addition to rune casting and sleight of hand, he will teach you to vanish coins, rings, jewelry and other small objects. You will also be taught how to move objects without touching them and how to "read" minds. As I'm sure you can imagine, magic is a superb DHV. Captivating and impressing an entire group of people goes a long way in raising your social value in the eyes of women. If there is one thing that Mystery knows more about than women, it is magic.
http://www.mysterymethod.com/schedule.htm
Tenmagnet is doing Mystery Method workshops in Toronto and Montreal.
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DJ: Upcoming 2 day inner game and storytelling programs:
This program focuses on how to take experiences from your life and convey them in an attractive, fun, and seductive way and incorporates everything from voice projection exercises to hypnotic language structures to deep inner work on who you are and what you want to convey. The first day is inner game intensive while the second day focuses on the mechanics of storytelling for a truly *complete* experience
Montreal: September 23rd and 24th. 1-9 pm each day. Portland, OR: October 7th and 8th. 1-9pm each day. Upcoming 1 day conversational/approach skills workshop featuring extensive value elicitation exercises and in classroom role playing with special guests.
NYC: October 13th 1-9pm
I've received so many requests to build in some of the "old school" material on value elicitation and creating a rapport that invites her to open up to you, that I've decided to build it into this program. There will be a special section on moving from flash attraction to true connection. Please contact me for a flier with more details!
I’m offering special discounts for these programs so please email me for details at dj_seminar@yahoo.com ...
Please paypal a $50 deposit to dj_seminar@yahoo.com to reserve your space.
I hope everyone is well and I look forward to hearing from you. Feel free to drop a line to say hello…
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DR. PAUL SPECIAL ANNOUNCEMENT:
We are officially announcing the "Dating and Relationship
Special Forces Training Camp", a seminar with Dr. Paul, the creator of the latest and most powerful technology for dating and relationships. Check the new Blog for the latest news or go to http://doctorpaul.net/products.htm .
Have you ever done quite well with sexual attraction but then found yourself dating or even in a relationship with someone totally not meant for you? Have you been through a breakup and not learned the three core lessons that MUST be pulled from the wreckage? Have you ever wondered where dating ends and (gulp) real love begins? Has your dating life helped or hurt your career? Your non-dating relationships? This is the SPECIAL FORCES TRAINING CAMP for DATING and RELATIONSHIPS.
-----
The new technology (DatingOS) Dr. Paul is unleashing on the world completely explains what your hangups are, not only in "hooking up" or "approaching," but through the dating process and deep into relationships. This doesn't exist anywhere else, nor will it, because Dr Paul has gone through twenty years of both psychiatric clinical training, seen 15,000 patients with problems of both a "dating" nature, AND comprehensively solves deep problems that people have with sexual attraction, commitment, marriage, breakups, relationships, trauma, depression, anxiety disorders, ADD, OCD, career complications, cheating and betrayal.
If you want permanent RESULTS, you may need some real science, and the same fun time you have at other seminars of course, with more mastery of ALL psychology of dating—INNER GAME, OUTER GAME, and never before seen PROFILING of women for perfect fit to your personality.
So far, DatingOS has only been available in person, at seminars in the heart of the city of SINGLES, in summertime after a bitter winter has all females in a frenzy of cabin fever.
Join us by contacting shauna@http://www.1shoppingcart.com/app/?af=531857 or see the announcement on http://doctorpaul.net/products.htm
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Herbal has started a new web site called "Tynan's Angels" where three of his beautiful female friends dispense pickup, dating, and sex advice every day. For more information, visit the site at http://www.tynansangels.com
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Brian has a network of sites at http://bogdock.com/ and in there he has launched a dating site, http://www.fullcontactdating.com/
which he generously has included a page for Cliff's List at:
http://www.fullcontactdating.com/index.php/cliffs-list/
which you should visit! As a reward for visiting Brian's site, you can get a F R E E copy of his new e-book which can be downloaded from:
http://www.fullcontactdating.com/index.php/btp/
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Dear fellow PUAs,
Probably you've heard that this year's EuroSummit will be held in London. After last year's awesome success in Vienna, we decided to take it to the
next level. In London, the nerve centre of Europe, we are getting ready to rock the world.
It will be held between Sep 8-10, the week after the RSD superconference. I won't give many details yet, but it's likely that three of the biggest names
- like Mystery, TD, and Badboy - will be present.Possibly, it will be the greatest FREE pickup event ever held. We are getting applications every day and you can check it out soon when we launch the site.
If have some PU experience and ready to travel, come join us, and take part in our celebration of the fairer sex. During these 3 days and 3 nights of sarging, you can meet some of the best PUAs and most beautiful girls in Europe, and you can also hold your speech if you'd like to.
Please write us that you'd like to join us in London provided all the people come you'd want to see.
It's a survey until we finish the site. You by NO MEANS will have an obligation to us, nor will your name be displayed on the EuroSummit site.
For advanced PUAs:
Please also tell us if you'd like to hold a speech, and of which topic. We'll schedule it then, but the final schedule will depend on the other speakers, too.
And after you send a pre-application, we'll send you the list of people who already signed up.
Please send your email to redpriest_hu@yahoo.com , with the subject "Euro Summit"
Thank you,
RedPriest
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Derek Vitalio:
Seduction Science Live In-Field Workshops!
The fact is, only by MODELING the very best can you achieve the very best. In a Seduction Science workshop, you'll meet and train with master coach McMaax who will take you to unique hot spots all over a particular city for meeting the most attractive, beautiful women. Your coach will demonstrate their skills and explain, teach, and show you how to interact with women at a club and on the street.
With a coach, you'll find an immediate shift in your skills and understanding with women as you see what it takes demoed live and right in front of you. And there's no reason to take the long and hard path or reinvent the wheel. After making hundreds of approaches, we've learned what works and what doesn't. We'll show you exactly how it's done and save you months, if not years of time.
You'll never have to go back to feeling lonely or lost and live passionately once again. Reserve your place as soon as possible (placing is limited!) so that you're guaranteed a spot.
For more information on the full workshop schedule visit: http://www.seductionscience.com/workshops
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Swinggcat has published a new ebook which you can check out at his website at http://www.realworldseduction.com. Those of you who remember his outstanding posts here will be anxious to get this as soon as possible. Highly recommended.
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Ross Jeffries Speed Seduction Seminars (http://www.speedseduction.net/)
Advanced Speed Seduction® Seminars - All Seminars Updated!
Look for more details soon, or call Dr. Yates at 903-482-1034. Price is $1,195. This seminar is ONLY open to those who own a Speed Seduction Home Study Course so you better hop on line and buy one now if you don't already have one and plan on attending.
Speed Seduction Seminars
Schedule 2006
Location Dates
London, England September 15, 16, 17
Speed Life Seminars
Schedule 2006
Location Dates
Hawaii (Location - Tentative) October 22 thru 26
Magick / Psychic Influence Seminars
Finished for 2006
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Major Mark (http://www.trucor.com):
Send mail to Cassi@trucor.com with questions or comments about his seminars.
Call to register: 419 882-8543 or go to http://www.trucor.com
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Double Your Dating LIVE! NEW Seminar! We will be reviewing all of the new DYD products here soon, including the monthly interview series in which David DeAngelo interviews "Dating Gurus".
You can order all your DYD products and register for seminars through this link: http://www.doubleyourdating.com/cl
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Threesomes! The Secrets To Making Your Fantasy A Reality
A home study course by David Shade http://www.masterful-lover.com/3somes.html
If you are like most men, you have had a fantasy about a threesome with 2 hot bi-sexual women. Everything you could possibly need to know about how to have threesomes is in this special information packed course.
The FIRST And ONLY, step-by-step guide written for men, featuring Pickup Artists and couples who are actually having threesomes all the time.
I GUARANTEE you that you've NEVER been exposed to, or had real Threesomes explained to you in the way I've done it here in this course!
It doesn't matter if you are in a relationship currently or not, every situation is covered here...
- The 3 scenarios to make a threesome happen (pick the one that works BEST for you)
- How to have threesomes as part of a committed relationship (and have it bring you closer together)
- The real truth about women and bisexuality (This will SURPRISE you)
- Proven methods to deal with your woman if she is on the fence about having a threesome. (You will have her begging you to make it happen)
- 4 vital things you MUST know about bisexual women (if you want to be successful having threesomes)
- How you can tell if a women is bi-sexual or not. (It's not what you think)
- The single biggest obstacle most women have to doing a threesome with their man. (when you can deal with this, the rest is easy)
- The foolproof way to bring up the subject of threesomes when you
have been with a woman for a long time. (This one is so powerful I almost didn't release it)
- The one thing you can say that shows a bisexual woman you are NOT like all the other guys (Do this and they might even fall in LOVE with you)
- Also, actual field reports of David & his girlfriend picking up bisexual women
- And much, much more...
The bottom line is that by learning how to have threesomes... YOU can live life fully and enjoy being a sensual person through expression of healthy sexuality in a mutually beneficial way.
Free samples of the course video online, check it out at http://www.masterful-lover.com/3somes.html
The classic 'David Shade Manual' goes online
You've done all the hard work, found the HB, attracted her, managed to get her back to your place, now you need to skills in the bedroom if
you want to keep the attraction going. Being able to give her the sexual experience of her life is the final tool in the seducer's
toolkit, so make sure you make the most of this opportunity. David Shade, as you are no doubt aware, is well known in the seduction
community as the master of bedmanship skills.
His masterpiece the 'David Shade Masterful Lover Manual' is now available for the first time online at http://www.alphalover.com/cmd.php?ad=145730 . Highly
recommended, it is p